Thread: ACKERMAN ANGLE

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    ACKERMAN ANGLE
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    I Read Thru The Posts But Im Lost On The Ackerman Angle, I Know What It Is But Not Sure How To Set It Up, If I Got The Kingpin Angle Correct, Top Joint Thru Bottom Joint To Center Of Tire Were It Meets The Ground. And Minimal Bumpsteer, Wont The Ackerman Angle Just Be There? And I Was Gonna Set Wheel At Zero Camber At Ride Height.
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    Also What Advantage Will I Get If I Rake My Front Mounts?
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    Rake
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    I think it will allow the front end to absorb bumps and improve ride. As the car rolls over bumps the arms swing up and slightly back. Some might say this has a negative impact on steering because it shortens wheelbase on the upstroke but it is probably insignificant.

    Look at the way quads are set up, then look at some of the well designed A-arm cars. Very similar.

    I'm told that rake and caster is not cumulative. So if you have 6* rake and 6* caster you don't have 12* of whatever you thought you'd have.

    I think the Ackerman thing got posted twice. If so I plan to consolidate the post. OK?
    Gene
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    ackerman,i read the post but i dont understand how i figure it in the geometry, and on the rake bit my frame is not raked but i think i could rake the mounts.
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    Right, rake the mounts
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    That's how mine was done by the builder. The front mounts were higher thant the rear so it was raked. Since the whole car was raked down in front it turned out that my effective rake was maybe 1 or 2*.

    The Ackerman thing was explained to me like this. Draw a line from the center of the rear axle to each front wheel vertical pivot line. Then I was told to do the same thing to some imaginary point in front of the car and if the lines crossed at the right point everything was good. Then I said "oh" and nodded affirmatively.

    So obviously my listening skills or comprehension on this subject was absent. Someone here will explain it in some rational way that we can use in the garage on the car or on paper.
    Gene
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    Ackerman is useless in the sand. Ackerman is for the pavement, the inside tire turns on a shorter radius than the outside. Incorperating Ackerman makes the inside tire turn sharper so it doesn't scrub against the street resulting in the car pushing. You don't get traction in the sand, you move and turn by displacing the sand since your tires are below the surface, street tires rely on the contact patch gripping the top of the road with as much tire surface as possible. I have a little ackerman in my design but I didn't do it on purpose. I designed my spindles the way I wanted them to look and since the control arms mount in front of the spindle, and are behind the kingpin angle, I have Ackerman as a side effect of the design. If I had the control arms mount behind the spindle, I would have negative Ackerman which is a big reason I mounted the rack in front.

    What advantage for rake?,..black and white difference. I set mine up at 15 degrees. Some people set theirs up at 0 and swear by it but facts say it's doesn't work as good. Average is around 6 degrees.

    When your front tire hits a bump, log, dip, whatever, the natural movement is for it to swing back, then up. Zero rake means the wheel doesn't go back, it swings straight up which is a jolt to the suspension (which can do damage over time like cracking or ripping out of tabs). When you have rake, the car is lifted over the obstruction, not jolted. It is very smooth which is less stress on your body and less stress on your rail. I've ridden in 2 rails that were setup basically the same except rake. One had about 6 degrees, one had 22 degrees,....trust me, there is a difference.............Yoshi
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    "oh" nodding affirmativley, lol, thanks gene im sure som 1 here will give me some input.
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    Ackerman is easy to design into the frame. You have a kingpin angle which you know about already, the center of the rear axle passes through the kingpin angle. This means that if you mount your control arm spindle heim in front of the spindle, to fall on the line that would give you perfect ackerman means it mounts past the kingpin angle, closer to the tire. If you mount your control arm spindle heim behind the spindle, to fall on the correct ackerman line means it would mount in front of the king pin angle, closer to the frame. Just like kingpin angle gets closer to the tire on the ground, and farther away from the tire at the top, Ackerman does something similiar from front to back. The line is farther from the tire in the rear, closer at the front.......
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    Hopefully this will clear it up a bit....
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    #10
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    click on it to make bigger....
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