Garage electrical help

**JagerDanger** · 07-19-2021 04:00 PM

As far as I can find, this is as close to the proper section on the forum for my inquiry.

So trying to keep this as a long story short(ish). My wife and I bought a house back in May. The garage is a 2 car detached, 24'x24' with two single stall doors, only one side has a garage opener. The power is fed through a single underground rated room the house. Current wire I believe is around 12ga, or at least small enough for a 15amp breaker from the house basement, which is only a 125 amp breaker panel. At the moment I've replaced the fluorescent light with a 48" LED to help.

However where the problem lies is, a single 15 amp breaker is not enough for what I need to do anything really. My current 140 welder needs a minimum of a 30 amp breaker to fully use everything on it (120v). So I need to rewire the whole garage, at the same time need to upgrade the service panel in the house because 125 amp is not enough between the house and garage.

Anyone have thoughts on where to even start? Haven't talked to an electrician yet, called the electric company to see if the wire going to the house would be enough for a 200 amp in the house, its number 4 wire so yes it is enough.

**bdkw1** · 07-19-2021 11:39 PM

If you replace the panel, go big. Even a 200A panel in the house kinda limits what you can do for a sub panel in the garage. Might also need to check with the power co. to see if your transformer is up to the task.

I have a 100A sub panel in the shop and it is marginal. My tig pulls 70A buy itself. Add in lights, compressor, stereo and AC and things go dark real quick. Of I'm running the mill I really can't do anything else.

**JagerDanger** · 07-20-2021 09:51 AM

Supposedly, the electric company says if I wanted to, I could run up to a 200 amp panel in the house and a 200 amp panel in the garage. What I'm wanting is a 240v Quincy two stage 60 gallon compressor, a decent size plasma cutter, then something like a Hobart 240 Iron Man or about that size welder. Garage will mostly have LED lighting, save for a dual halogen work light tripod, as it gets cold in the winter and they produce a ton of heat which helps.

Garage is unfinished and uninsulated, so once the wiring is finalized, insulation will be installed with possibly sheet metal instead of drywall over it, since only certain types of drywall have any fire rating.

**bdkw1** · 07-20-2021 10:14 PM

200 for the house and 200 for the shop? Will they be on the same meter?

Avoid dual meters, it adds extra monthly costs and opens the door for them to charge you different rates for the shop versus the residential rates of the house. Or at least that's the games that go in a lot of places.

Don't forget an outdoor RV plug in. If you go with the 50A 2 pole one it will double as a welder plug in.

**JagerDanger** · 07-21-2021 01:07 AM

Okay I misspoke, I had to look up the options the electric company gave me. Fortunately I had texted my dad the options.

At the moment, the power coming to the house comes in an above line. For $500, the power company can come in and trench the line under ground. Overall that's probably something I'll have them do just to keep the liability low for me in the case of a tree falling.

Option one was new meter installed in the yard, but the wiring would be my responsibility. So not ideal. The other option was for them to upgrade the power lines to the house to a 320, which would allow for a 200 amp in the house and a 200 amp in the garage. I misspoke before, the number 4 wire is only enough for a single 200 amp for the house currently. The would have to bump up the gauge if I want to do the dual 200 amp.

Realistically, the house itself only needs a 150 amp box. The A/C, dryer, and stove and range are all 240 volt. Everything else in the house is 120 volt. If I were to split off a 200 amp box to the garage, it would have to be in half, so 100 amps in the house and 100 amps in the garage.

At most unless I get a Crossfire Pro CNC plasma table, only an air compressor and welder or compressor and plasma cutter would be running at any given time, in the addition of garage lights and work lights.

I'm probably working this more complicated than it needs to be, it's been over a month since I last talked to the power company about any of this and besides a minimalist text to my dad about it, my memory is fuzzy at best about it.

**bdkw1** · 07-21-2021 08:32 PM

A 100A sub panel in the shop is plenty for most people. Just try not to run everything at once LOL. Underground is the way to go.

**JagerDanger** · 07-22-2021 03:45 PM

Yeah underground is what I'll end up doing. If will be nice to actually be able to build stuff again.

**JagerDanger** · 07-24-2021 11:12 PM

My dad made back out here again (he was on his way back from Wyoming) and we are revisiting and going over the best solution. We have enough power for sure where I can realistically run a 200 amp main panel in the house and a 100 sub panel in the garage. If I really need to do some welding, when he helped us move from our apartment into the house, he brought about 50ft of 10ga wire, that I can run into the house panel to the garage standalone breaker and swap out to a 30 amp. I do have enough room to do it as is. Going out to the garage now is 12 AWG which is ample for a 20amp. Fine for small stuff, but not welding.

So then the plan is to save up about $6000, have the power ran underground to the house, have a 200 installed inside the house and a 100 sub in the garage. Unless the electric company or electricians think I should go larger.

If there's some sort of electrical calculator app I can find, that could help a lot in figuring this all out.

**JagerDanger** · 08-23-2021 01:09 AM

Well, I'm an idiot. After finding the owner's manual for my welder, the company that made the welder (Northern Industrial and whatever chinese firm), recommends a 20 amp breaker. So theoretically, I could run more 12ga wire in the garage to help with the issue then. Since only one outlet has 12ga wire to it. But overall the plan still hasn't changed to run more power to it.

I'm also thinking about getting a small contractor job site table saw and a few other wood working tools. Kind of want to do some metal and wood working projects together. Wife and I kind of like the industrial/rustic look on furniture.

But now I can do some welding, just at current in one part in the garage. So first thing first, either build the work bench or wire one more outlet with 12ga or maybe the 10ga I have.

**Ron_J** · 08-25-2021 10:37 AM

I built a detached garage last summer and wired it with a sub panel off of the house 200 amp main.

I'd say you will need to at least upgrade your house to a 200 amp service and 100 amp sub in the garage. I have dedicated circuits for the welders, compressors, lights, each wall and ceiling outlets. I haven't had any issues with 100 amp, but then again I'm a one man show and don't have anything that draws so much that I can't run that and the lights and radio.

Look into mobile home feeder cable to run from the house to garage.