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railcrzy
04-10-2007, 07:23 AM
I have a honda 954 and i would like to put an external oil cooler if possible.
Does anyone know of something i can buy to thread into where the oil filter goes that will allow me to run a cooler?

Please help my motor got up to 240 degrees at glamis last weekend. Im running the honda engine oil, and a radiator and fan, but it still gets hot.

Larry

Rorty
04-10-2007, 07:57 AM
You should PM biklomen; he made a spin-on adaptor for his Honda, so the threads are probably the same. It may may be for sale too if you're quick!

yoshi
04-10-2007, 09:40 AM
And i've got a stack of oil coolers i'll sell you, I take them off the busa motors cause I don't need them...

railcrzy
04-10-2007, 12:44 PM
Hey yoshi,

U said u have some coolers?
Those coolers thread into the filter spot?
Im interested. How much?
Do u have a pic or diagram how it looks?
Thanks Larry

yoshi
04-10-2007, 01:22 PM
stock busa coolers, you can buy a plate that threads on your oilfilter to runa cooler, at least I know you can for cars...



the cooler is just a stock one off a busa, not sure what they're worth but $60 sounds good and i'll pay shipping....

yoshi
04-10-2007, 01:22 PM
That pic is when I was using the coolers, found out they are a waste of time, especially with the size radiator i'm running...

bikelomen
04-10-2007, 03:53 PM
I had drawn one up by purchasing a oil filter sandwich adapter with a 20mm thread adapter and copying the design. The sandwich adapter was 3/16" to large of an OD to fit on my engine. I drew the one up and was going to have Dan Roberto make me one although I think bugpac could probobly turn one. Simple design if you bought a stock one for a chevy motor you would see how they work. I never had a chance to have one made as my motor tanked before I had it hooked up. I was going to run my car and see if I really needed it as the stock system is suppose to be pretty efficient.

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 05:09 PM
I'd like to feel safe about omitting the oil cooler.It would be less hassle and one less thing to buy/break.Yoshi have you monitored the oil temp when running hard?I'm logging it seems like everything but oil temp working on the turbo map.I never paid any attention to what guages you're running and curious what you may have seen for max oil temp w/o an oil cooler.I know the water temp is no problem but what about oil temp?C'mon I'm not effin' witchya,I really would like to know. [smilie=biggrin.gif] Anyone else have any info on this?Who all is running a busa n/a or turbo'd without oil cooler. railcrzy seems I jacked your thread.I hope you got the info you need.

railcrzy
04-10-2007, 05:37 PM
Well the shop said " my valves need adjusting" $300. Then when they went to tune in the power commander 3 cylinders compression was i think he said 175 and should be around 155 or 160 and the last cyl.. was lower than what it should be.

Could the valves be out far enough to cause all that?? "hi and low compression change and hi temp?

larry

Rorty
04-10-2007, 05:43 PM
Why risk destroying the engine? If it ran an oil cooler in stock form, then in a buggy, you owe it to the engine to run a cooler at least as large as the stock one. Even if the water temp reads within limits without the oil cooler plumbed in, you would still probably be causing engine damage.

The oil cooler works in unison with the radiator, and both are essential to the health of the engine. Running an oversized radiator solely will not provide the same degree of cooling or protection.

I don't understand your concerns of breaking the cooler. If it's sensibly located and correctly plumbed in, there's no reason why it should be a liability. Ducting air to a radiator or oil cooler in a buggy is usually a sure way to destroy them. I've seen rads and coolers that were mounted "out of harm's way" but with ducts to divert cool air towards them. All that seems to happen is that stones are funnelled into the cores and destroys them quicker than if they were located in clean air without ducting.

Ducting works fine for on-road cars, but in my experience of off-road racing, ducts are a death knell.

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 07:23 PM
Well the shop said " my valves need adjusting" $300. Then when they went to tune in the power commander 3 cylinders compression was i think he said 175 and should be around 155 or 160 and the last cyl.. was lower than what it should be.

Could the valves be out far enough to cause all that?? "hi and low compression change and hi temp?

larryYes they could be the cause and if it's not been run long like that they may only need adjusting.The shop should have done a cylinder leakage test to determine if the valves are just out of adjustment or if the exhaust seat is burnt on the low cylinder.The higher compression readings are most likely from carbom build-up and would tend to make me suspicious of a burned ex seat and or valve on the low cylinder.fabr.

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 07:24 PM
Well the shop said " my valves need adjusting" $300. Then when they went to tune in the power commander 3 cylinders compression was i think he said 175 and should be around 155 or 160 and the last cyl.. was lower than what it should be.

Could the valves be out far enough to cause all that?? "hi and low compression change and hi temp?

larryYes they could be the cause and if it's not been run long like that they may only need adjusting.The shop should have done a cylinder leakage test to determine if the valves are just out of adjustment or if the exhaust seat is burnt on the low cylinder.The higher compression readings are most likely from carbom build-up and would tend to make me suspicious of a burned ex seat and or valve on the low cylinder.fabr.

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 07:47 PM
Why risk destroying the engine? If it ran an oil cooler in stock form, then in a buggy, you owe it to the engine to run a cooler at least as large as the stock one. Even if the water temp reads within limits without the oil cooler plumbed in, you would still probably be causing engine damage.

The oil cooler works in unison with the radiator, and both are essential to the health of the engine. Running an oversized radiator solely will not provide the same degree of cooling or protection.

I don't understand your concerns of breaking the cooler. If it's sensibly located and correctly plumbed in, there's no reason why it should be a liability. Ducting air to a radiator or oil cooler in a buggy is usually a sure way to destroy them. I've seen rads and coolers that were mounted "out of harm's way" but with ducts to divert cool air towards them. All that seems to happen is that stones are funnelled into the cores and destroys them quicker than if they were located in clean air without ducting.

Ducting works fine for on-road cars, but in my experience of off-road racing, ducts are a death knell.Rorty I fully agree with all that you said about needing the oil cooler I was just wanting to know if the large radiator could possibly be keeping the oil temps at normal levels without the use of an oil cooler on an engine that the factory felt was needed or the money wouldn't have been invested in one in the first place. .I doubt it but yoshi said he didn't need it and wondered if it had actually been monitored or if it was just a "cause I know so" statement.I feel that an oil cxooler is very beneficial at maintaining correct overall engine temps.I've spent a lot of time on dynos with theV-8 Drag motors and I can say without a doubt an oil cooler will lower water temps on most big engines anyway.Most are extremely tough even if bent up and will be no problem.I'm really not too worried about a radiator failure but I will still mount it low and rear on the next build.A proper shrouding I feel is possible that will allow unrestricted airflow and yet prevent debris damage to it.A 90 degree route with a bottom drop out for debris to fall out before it gets to the rad.Mount the rad in line with the chassis centerline.Seen them mounted that way many times but none had any provision for protection.Just an idea that I feel can be made to work.Man all I can say is that I've seen hot water burns and they are DEEP.I will try most anything to prevent being burned by fire or water.Call me dumb if you wish. [smilie=biggrin.gif]

K-fab
04-10-2007, 07:59 PM
Why not run one of the radiators that has the oil core built in it already???

We set up the new 10 Dez with a C&R radiator and an external oil cooler that sits right along side the radiator. (left side)

Both radiators will have a screen in front of them that sits about 1/2" off, keeps out big rocks and twigs and such.

http://www.yellowdogracing.com/DeztazII/radiator.jpg

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 08:09 PM
I just had a thought.A scary thing at best! [smilie=biggrin.gif] But I was thinking that the ability of water to effectively spray through a screen is fairly small and screen could actually serve 2 purposes.Deflecting debris from the front and also deflecting possible coolant spray from the rear.I'm starting to think I've seen some small louvered material that may just be the ticket.I'll try to check it out tomorrow.

K-fab
04-10-2007, 08:33 PM
Not a bad idea. - or thought for that matter. *[smilie=biggrin.gif]

You got me thinking about crashes and radiators.

I've rolled the Dez twice in the dunes, endoed it once in the dunes, threw it away big time in the desert race and then I rolled it off the side of a mountain last summer.

If the tumble down the hill during the race - took out two 4" diam trees, rolled/flipped in the bushes, broke lots of stuff on the car including the front stub axles didn't wad the radiator
And
If the roll over the mountain side into the trees didn't poke a hole in it

I would have to believe that I'm pretty safe from getting burned. *I also wear a three layer suit, as I sure don't want to get burned. *

The side panels and the roof panel probably have a huge amount to do with protection, the visor and lower wind screen on the hood also probably do a good job of deflecting incoming rocks - they have enough pock marks on them to show they at least do something. *The space our heads take up also protects the radiator. *I doubt that much more than a 1/3 of the surface is actually in direct line of fire from the front.

It also has a very effective rock catching screen in front of it - anything over 1/4" gets filtered out and often seems to find it's way down the back of my fire suit. *[smilie=blink.gif]

About the only way to get to my radiator would be from a direct rear hit with a stick or branch or Jousting Rod (held by a very large chicken).

I guess what I'm getting at is that if you do have your radiator mounted up high, make sure it's well protected.

The old car doesn't have any sort of cover or air flow control panel on the back side - just the fan in the middle of it. *The new car, as you can see in the pix, has a shroud over the back side that ducts to the fan. *That, along with the full body panel setup and the screen makes me pretty confident that we'll be safe from any FOD induced radiator leaks.

Just debating my point of view with ya Fabr... [smilie=blowkiss.gif]
Now if'n you go and get all ugly on me, I'll have to release that Jousting Chicken upon your car's radiator!
I keep one around all the time,
just in case....

masterfabr
04-10-2007, 09:01 PM
WHat you guys are not seeing is that I'm not really concerned with a rad collision with debris as much as a failure of a seam or core or hose from unforseen corrosion or overheat overflow or????Why don't you bring that jousting chicken to LS Memorial Day weekend?

K-fab
04-11-2007, 04:35 AM
The radiators in both cars are rubber mounted. *Never seen any signs of stress on the Old Dez's.

I know the frame flexes - been through four fuel tanks due to it, but the rad is isolated enough that it's never been an issue.

I did lose a hose once - it's down low and not able to spew on the passenger compartment.

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 05:57 AM
THey call those jousting chickens PHEASANTS down here.But to further the jousting match can you honestly tell me that you've never heard of a rad failure of any kind and that you've never heard of anyone getting burned from it? The arguement tyhat "it's never happened to me" is not valid IMO.Hell ,I've never been hit by lightning and don't expect to either.Doesn't keep several people a year from getting zapped/killed tho does it?Call me chicken if you want.I call it preventative design. [smilie=biggrin.gif]

Rorty
04-11-2007, 07:02 AM
Why not run one of the radiators that has the oil core built in it already???

Or use a Laminova which doesn't have any fins or a core to get damaged. They're quite expensive, but perfect for a buggy that's subjected to flying debris and mud build up.

yoshi
04-11-2007, 07:02 AM
What I know about the oil cooler for the busa motor is it's not needed. *You can call suzuki, it was actually designed to run without it. *Running the bigger radiator takes care of any issues you may think are there. *King has something like 55 cars out there now with quite a few years in the dunes and I know for a fact that they don't run coolers, if there were any problems whatsoever with the system, they would have started using coolers a while back as they come free with the motors and they prob. have a stack of them sitting around. *I also don't run the pear valve or any of the breathers from above the headers, it's set up that way from the factory but isn't needed....


I run the stock gauges, my oil and water lights always read normal, The fan doesn't even run that much, and since i'm wrapping my headers with exhaust wrap, I am keeping a lot of excess heat from hitting the motor which helps as well......

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 07:34 AM
does anyone have an oil temp guage on the busa that can relate what the actual oil temp is either with or without the cooler.The idiot light is a little vague on that.Any one have a turboed busa that can tell me the diff in oil temp with and without the cooler?I'd just like educated.

busasandrail
04-11-2007, 08:25 AM
I have both a cooler and a gauge set up one mine and also had a oil cooler failure last year so I know first hand what the differences are. My cooler is a permacool oil cooler that I picked up from summit. it has an electric fan on it which was being used right before it failed. Well after bypassing the unit with a bypass hose and running it just as before I noticed a 10-15 degree difference in water temp and at least a 20 degree difference in the oil temps. The only difference being the lack of an oil cooler.
I pesonally would never build a car with out one after seeing how well they work.

Just my .02

yoshi
04-11-2007, 08:59 AM
what temp was it running, i've been told by someone that knows a lot about busa motors that they actually run better a bit hotter than factory. *He said some people are setting their fans up to run all the time and the motor is running too cool and effecting performance. *He has a dyno and has done lots of tinkering. *He also sets the thermostats to come on a bit later than what they would from the factory, so an increase in oil temp might not necessarly be that bad of a deal.

busasandrail, where was your radiator mounted and was your fan running all the time if mounted low indicating it was always running warm. *If you didn't have enough cooling for your radiator I can see you noticing a big difference without an oil cooler. I wouldn't have eleminated my cooler if I would have kept the radiator mounted lower lie my first rail....Also, did you have a turbo, that makes a difference as well and I would run an aftermarket cooler on any rail I installed a turbo system on. *I don't think the stock motor needs them...IMO with my current knowledge...

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 09:51 AM
OK ,after reading many pages of discussion on * www.suzukihayabusa.org (http://www.suzukihayabusa.org) * this is what I have come up with.This is in line with what busa sandrail experienced.Turbo busa with oil cooler 190 degree oil temp average.Without oil cooler 240 degrees and up to 280 when running hard/long (like we do).Seems to me that Suzuki spent the money for a reason and I will take their word for it along with real world scenarios.So,again it comes down to who do we want to believe.I'll take the busa abusers and suzuki's word on this one.Run an oil cooler regardless whether or not any of the builders use one or not.Suzuki would not have spent the money if it was not needed.Now if anyone wants to argue the point with real world info I'm all ears.As I said I would like to eliminate the expense/hassle of installing one but once again I want to be safe not sorry.Just makes sense to me to do so.This is one of those things that carry a lot of disagreement among builders but my question is this:Why would you take the advise of a builder that has 50 or 100 or whatever buggies built instead of the OEM that has thousands of motors and spent hundreds of thousands in development???????They did it because it was needed.So unless someone can show no increase in oil temp deleting the cooler I feel this subject should be a done deal.Use the cooler if it came with one and add one if necessary.

busasandrail
04-11-2007, 09:56 AM
My motor is a 1397 with no turbo....All of my coolers are mounted behind the seats down low.....with fans running when needed. The motor usually runs 180-200 with both coolers hooked up, subtract the oil cooler and both went up.
And yes the motor could potentially make more power when it runs hotter but it also puts more strain on the parts.
And I'm pretty sure the factory would have elimitated the oil cooler if it wasn't needed but who knows maybe they just put it on there for the heck of it.

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 10:07 AM
[smilie=biggrin.gif]

busasandrail
04-11-2007, 10:20 AM
By the way about the King setup, I rode with a King car last year at St Anthonies Idaho and he did have over heating probelms, he ran aroung 210-220 most of the time and if he pushed it it would get hot enough to boil over. The outside air temp was between 80-90 degrees.

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 11:03 AM
Kind of proves a point,huh?The point being that the coolant mostly only serves to cool the cylinders and head area of an engine.Duh, that's where it circulates. The oil pulls heat from crank/ rods /rockers and most of the internals.That heat has to go somewhere and that is usually into the engine coolant.The thermostat is there to keep the coolant at a stable temp.The addition of an oil cooler will remove some of the oil heat before it goes into the coolant. That lightens the load on the cooling system.An oversize radiator will keep the coolant /head/cylinders cool *but the oil temp is still capable of climbing above water temps.Not good for all the lower internals.

yoshi
04-11-2007, 11:12 AM
My motor is a 1397 with no turbo....All of my coolers are mounted behind the seats down low.....with fans running when needed. The motor usually runs 180-200 with both coolers hooked up, subtract the oil cooler and both went up.
And yes the motor could potentially make more power when it runs hotter but it also puts more strain on the parts.
And I'm pretty sure the factory would have elimitated the oil cooler if it wasn't needed but who knows maybe they just put it on there for the heck of it.There's prob. a happy medium, i'm not saying 200 degrees above the normal is better, but it sounds like 30-50 degrees more is the norm in a turbo busa streetbike with the normal radiator, and that was on a streetike with a turbo that didn't have an oversize radiator to cool the block down, so masterfabers reply saying the oil temp was upward of 280 in some case on the turbo busa setup, you have to factor in 3 things, the radiator is infront of the headers so there's more heat and less airflow, the radiator is smaller and it has a smaller fan. *Run it higher and the temp won't get nearly as hot I guarentee it. *far as the factory setting things up and that has to be the right way, give me a break, you have a nice big dully, i'm sure you have a chip, an exhaust, and a filter getting a lot more power outta your setup, factory doesn't necesarlly set things up right, they set things up well withen their safety margin. *Who leaves anything stock these days wether its a mc powerplant or a car, nothing wrong with running the motor a little hotter, especially if it's not nearly as hot as some people are suggesting because they are comparing my setup to a turbo busa with a lot less cooling capabilities do to placement and size of the cooler...

I haven't had any over heating problems with my rail, my fan wasn't even running that much and it wasn't exactly cold the last time I was out..

yoshi
04-11-2007, 11:14 AM
oh yeah, and as far as the king car having some overheating problems, they not only mount their radiator low, but it's also mounted sideways so it doesn't get nearly the amount of airflow to cool the motor as a higher mounted radiator and like I said, when I mounted mine low, I ran an oil cooler as well, mounting it high doesn't concern me..

yoshi
04-11-2007, 11:20 AM
Kind of proves a point,huh?The point being that the coolant mostly only serves to cool the cylinders and head area of an engine.Duh, that's where it circulates. The oil pulls heat from crank/ rods /rockers and most of the internals.That heat has to go somewhere and that is usually into the engine coolant.The thermostat is there to keep the coolant at a stable temp.The addition of an oil cooler will remove some of the oil heat before it goes into the coolant. That lightens the load on the cooling system.An oversize radiator will keep the coolant /head/cylinders cool *but the oil temp is still capable of climbing above water temps.Not good for all the lower internals.well now that depends on how much hotter, hotter does run better. Too hot and you will prematurely wear parts, but there is still some room to run better and not be harmeful...

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 11:35 AM
Yoshi,I'm not argueing whether or not the coolant stays at a reasonable temp for you.On the other hand you don't know what the oil temp is since you have (as do I)only an idiot light for oil pressure and nothing to monitor oil temp.The guys running n/a or turbo seem to be in agreement that an oil cooler is needed.When you pop an oil temp guage on one of yours and report back with the results you may have a leg to stand on but for now I'll take the reports from those that have checked the temps as factual.BTW my 2007 Duramax has nothing done to it and these things are far different from the 2002 models.NO,no chip or anything needed.But most of us that do so realize the need for oil and coolant temps to be kept within limits.Do you not understand that the oil/coolant temps are related but also independent????

yoshi
04-11-2007, 12:14 PM
Yoshi,I'm not argueing whether or not the coolant stays at a reasonable temp for you.On the other hand you don't know what the oil temp is since you have (as do I)only an idiot light for oil pressure and nothing to monitor oil temp.The guys running n/a or turbo seem to be in agreement that an oil cooler is needed.When you pop an oil temp guage on one of yours and report back with the results you may have a leg to stand on but for now I'll take the reports from those that have checked the temps as factual.BTW my 2007 Duramax has nothing done to it and these things are far different from the 2002 models.NO,no chip or anything needed.But most of us that do so realize the need for oil and coolant temps to be kept within limits.Do you not understand that the oil/coolant temps are related but also independent????I understand that the temps are different, I also understand your comparing apples to oranges. *Busa in a bike is different than busa in a sandrail. *Your going by temp numbers from turbo busa rails with small, low placed radiators with not nearly as much airflow, so to say I am running as hot as they are is not factual because I have better cooling placement and a much bigger cooling radiator. *I also can't say i'm 100 percent sure i'm running withen acceptable temp limits, even though it doesn't concern me. *I will get a gauge hooked up so I have some actual data to give you in the real world with a high mounted radiator, and I guarentee it will be running cooler than the numbers given by the guys at the turbobusa forum. *Is it running hotter than stock, yes, is it running too hot, I don't think so, but I will use facts to back that up when they are available....

bdkw1
04-11-2007, 12:46 PM
Hey Master, you running a ball or plain bearing turbo?

On a Toyota 22R that I turboed years ago, the turbo would cook the oil. I ended up putting a small cooler in the feed line to the turbo in addition to the stock heat exchanger i got off a factory torbo motor.

masterfabr
04-11-2007, 01:24 PM
It will be interesting to see the numbers.I can't say one way or the other but for now I'll take the facts I have and continue the use of the cooler.I sincerely hope you are correct so I can ditch the oil cooler also but till then I'll probably do the same and do my own investigation.All I need to do is hook up the extra thermocouple to the logger.I wish this would have come up before I moved the radiator. [smilie=blush.gif] I seriously wish to know for sure the of the facts on my own application which may or may not apply to any other application.I do understand that it is possible to have the oil temps to be acceptable with only a radiator but it is equally possible for the oil temps to be very high without raising the coolant temp with a large enough radiator.Without actually checking the oil temp it's a guess at best if it's in an acceptable range.

railcrzy
04-13-2007, 03:21 PM
WOW has this topic took off and drifted of what?
Well anyhow my 954 does not come stock with oil cooler.Only radiator.No outlet to run filter.
I found a sandwich adapter on e-bay for a honda civic, but i just looked and there is no room. The header is too close to the oil filter.

Oh and just a little note. The HONDA oil filters that are i think $8 or $12. Well my friend just tried the $3 Bigger filter that fits his accord, fits my bike. *[smilie=biggrin.gif]

He gets them from work so i pay $0. Good deal huh?

Well hopefully now that my valves were adjusted my car will run cooler. They shop said my valves were out of spec and my compression now is where it should be. If i continue to have heat issues, ill look into a biger radiator i gues..

Thanks for the suggestions.

larry

Rorty
04-13-2007, 04:03 PM
The HONDA oil filters that are i think $8 or $12. Well my friend just tried the $3 Bigger filter that fits his accord, fits my bike. *[smilie=biggrin.gif]

He gets them from work so i pay $0. Good deal huh?

What are the stolen filters used for? They may not be as good at filtering engine oil as the OEM ones and you may be courting engine damage. Just a thought.

According to the specs I have, from 2002 the 954 comes with a round, stainless steel liquid cooled oil cooler. What year is yours?

Anyway, how can a sandwich plate be bigger than the filter it replaces? *[smilie=blink.gif]

tenaja
04-13-2007, 04:59 PM
At that cost savings, it'd be worth it to tear them both apart to see if the car filter is as good at filtering as the bike filter.

renegadespec1
04-13-2007, 05:52 PM
I'm *[smilie=bs_offtopic.gif]
But, what are the dimensions of those cooler Yoshi, I have that CBR 1000 It has a cooler on it but was thinking of a second because I will have to mount them low...and out of good clean airflow in front and behind them... Even with ducting...[smilie=drool.gif]

railcrzy
04-13-2007, 07:58 PM
Well he gets the filters at his cost of $3, he owns the shop, and me favors.so
Mine is a 02 954. Is that what that little thing is before the filter? Well im not a bike builder, but that wouldnt seem to cool much when it never really leave the engine,and its cooled by the HOT anti freeze.

I wanted to run a cooler that leaves the moteor for about 18"or so then through the cooler and back.
The filter is about 3/4 in. away from exhaust. The sandwich in the picture i saw looked to be about an 1"to 1 1/2in. thick. This threads in then the filter goes on. Long story short the filter would stick out about 1" further.

Oh yeah, I didnt get off the topic I started it!! [smilie=blowkiss.gif]

Rorty
04-13-2007, 08:13 PM
Is that what that little thing is before the filter? ...that wouldnt seem to cool much when it never really leave the engine,and its cooled by the HOT anti freeze.

I wanted to run a cooler that leaves the moteor for about 18"or so then through the cooler and back.

Do you have a pic of the fittings on the round Honda cooler? If it's got threaded unions, you could plumb a Laminova cooler in there in its place which would be perfect!



The filter is about 3/4 in. away from exhaust. The sandwich in the picture i saw looked to be about an 1"to 1 1/2in. thick. This threads in then the filter goes on. Long story short the filter would stick out about 1" further.

If you can bolt a takeoff plate in there in stead of the filter, then you can mount a [url=http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/adapters/remote_filter.html:18sd7g7v]remote filter head[/url:18sd7g7v] and oil cooler where ever is convenient. See [url=http://www.thinkauto.com/remote.htm:18sd7g7v]here[/url:18sd7g7v] too.

railcrzy
04-14-2007, 06:42 AM
Thanks Rorty thats what i need. Now i need to figure out how to get it to that. Of course the sandwich has the filter threads.
Im wondering if i could plug where the filter goes in "on the sand.."and just use the plumbed lines to run to that external oil filter, then cooler and back.
Well im getting there.
Thanks

Rorty
04-14-2007, 07:33 AM
A sandwich plate is a take-off plate that's sandwiched between the engine and the filter. What you want is just a plain take-off plate (with out the galleries that lead through to the filter).

In essence what it looks like is a thick disc of aluminium with a banjo bolt through its centre that screws into the filter threads, and it also has the two male unions sticking out the side which are the inlet and outlet for the oil hoses.

If you don't have a lathe, you could make one with a couple of holesaws (one for the O-ring groove), a tap and a couple of drill bits.

railcrzy
04-14-2007, 10:37 AM
Thanks again.
Yeah that's what i need.
Any idea where to get something like that??
Im far from being a machinest. [smilie=alright.gif]

railcrzy
04-14-2007, 10:40 AM
Like this?

railcrzy
04-14-2007, 10:42 AM
opps sorry just figured out thats the wrong one.

bikelomen
04-14-2007, 12:10 PM
I would use your sandwich plate that you have and get a high quality filter. The relocation filter is just going to relocate it and will have the same threads as the sandwich plate filter threads. The only difference is its on a mountable bracket so you can run a hose to the filter plate instead of having to use it right on the motor. Use the fram or whatever filter on the sandwich plate then use your filter on the relocation kit. you will have a dual filter set up then. The other relocation kits all seem not to fit. I tried them as well. The outer flange on them hits the case. If you found a sandwich plate then use it and dual filter your oil.

Anyway try looking up a relocation kit for the same type of car that you found the sandwich plate. You will need it for mounting the remote filter anyway.

http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch ... 4294907606 (http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+4294817872+4294907813+115+4294 907606)

Rorty
04-14-2007, 04:23 PM
There's a company in the UK that I used to deal with regularly, Think Automotive, but there's bound to be a similar company in the US who supply all the oil cooler fittings. What about Mocal, Earls etc.?

railcrzy
04-27-2007, 08:39 AM
http://cm.ebay.com/cm/ck/1065-29392-235 ... 0108323301 (http://cm.ebay.com/cm/ck/1065-29392-2357-0?uid=41633212&site=0&ver=EOIBSA080805&lk=ItemDescriptionANDimage&Item=250108323301)

not sure if that link worked.
I found that the sandwich is a 20mm and honda accord 1996 fits the 2002 cbr 954.

bdkw1
04-27-2007, 09:17 AM
Holy krap thats cheap!

railcrzy
05-05-2007, 01:30 PM
Yes it was now i just need to find the cooler with the fan on it.
I think yoshi had some off of the hayabusa?
larry

Kane
05-22-2007, 03:55 PM
Why not run one of the radiators that has the oil core built in it already???

We set up the new 10 Dez with a C&R radiator and an external oil cooler that sits right along side the radiator. (left side)

Both radiators will have a screen in front of them that sits about 1/2" off, keeps out big rocks and twigs and such.

http://www.yellowdogracing.com/DeztazII/radiator.jpg

K-fab is that a in tank type cooler? i couldn't find one on C&R but I remember seeing one on PWR that's similar