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NinjaRaptor
10-20-2013, 11:08 AM
This is a continuation of the XK1000 Single Seat buggy built by ProtoDie. I purchased the rolling chassis and extra's from Protodie. For those familiar with Jody and his work, I was certainly happy once I got it home. What I have left to do is really assembly and detail work at this point.

Attached are pics on what I have done so far, basically the brake line system routing and installation. I also swapped the rear tires from 26 inch blaster pro's to regular blaster's. Oddly enough the pro's are more like 28 inch tires, the regular blaster's are just below 27 inch. See attached picture of rim and tire shipped to me, still cracks me up how they get that in a box, squared up and all for shipping.

Next up are lights and some sort of fabrication for a left foot rest when I am not using the clutch. The Coyote has one built as part of the frame and I have found it useful when you get a little out of sorts on the dunes.....

I am also saving up for a donor engine kit, most likely find something from reputable salvage company. I no longer have space to strip a running bike down and get what I need for this build.....frustrating to say the least....I went from a 4 car garage to a 2 car, and calling it a 2 car is a stretch....rigafratz (for those that remember Yosemite Sam)!


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NinjaRaptor
10-20-2013, 11:10 AM
And a few more pics for the brake lines....

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JGSturbo
10-20-2013, 11:21 AM
I wish my final assembly looked that nice... All tho I think I'm still in the primary assembly, DOH.
Good job, I'll expect to see it on the sand ASAP[smilie=ph34r.gif]

NinjaRaptor
10-20-2013, 12:13 PM
I wish my final assembly looked that nice... All tho I think I'm still in the primary assembly, DOH.
Good job, I'll expect to see it on the sand ASAP[smilie=ph34r.gif]

Roger that, my goal is to have it there next season, if not sooner. Of course, I have a 10 year old boy for additional motivation. He keeps pushing for nitrous, turbo, blower, etc.......gets it from mom.....:D

Next time I get to the dunes, I'll let people know when. It would be good to hook up with others in the Oregon area.

NoClue
10-21-2013, 09:28 AM
Nice!!! Another thread to follow.

You think the square tire is going to be a bit rough? Lol.

skreikem
10-21-2013, 10:04 AM
Nice indeed! Man that thing is pretty! I think I'd be the guy that avoided mud puddles at all costs with that :D Looks great!

ProtoDie
10-21-2013, 12:13 PM
looking good,
and looking forward to seeing videos in a few months. :D

NinjaRaptor
10-21-2013, 12:43 PM
Thanks for the comments guys. I am sure this buggy will put a smile on my face once we get to the dunes. My biggest challenge will be keeping the keys away from my son:d

alex_buggy
10-21-2013, 01:00 PM
that's one nice looking ride!

NinjaRaptor
10-21-2013, 03:38 PM
Nice!!! Another thread to follow.

You think the square tire is going to be a bit rough? Lol.

No doubt on the rough ride:D, those guys at Fullerton Sand Sports know how to pack and ship a tire. They were very helpful with options on this sandrail and have been good to work with on previous projects.

NinjaRaptor
10-27-2013, 05:22 PM
So my son and I have been doing a bit more work to the sandrail. We built a foot rest for the sandrail next to the clutch pedal. That will give me a place for my leg to push on when I am running through the dunes. My son Jake (10 years old) help install it as well. Always good to help kids learn something. See pics below.

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Jake has also been interested in ProtoDie's XK450, but since he has seen the XK1000, he now wants one of those. I told him that he's too small for the XK1000. He was willing to compromise....says he will go down to an XK900.........God help me[smilie=rolleyes.gi:

On another note, I did some research on lights for the buggy. Found some from TrailTech that look good and should fit well given their size. They are back ordered, but should be here in 3-4 weeks. Check out the link below for info.

Trail Tech || Equinox LED 60mm Billet Light: Spot, straight post, black (http://www.trailtech.net/lighting/led/led-utv/equinox-led-60mm-billet-light-spot-straight-post-black)

chrisMX-15
10-27-2013, 06:10 PM
Very nice but i think that square tire in first pic will rob alot of power lol just kidding looks great and wish i had a son to help on mine wife not into it for some reason:D[smilie=gun_chair.g:

NinjaRaptor
10-27-2013, 06:58 PM
Very nice but i think that square tire in first pic will rob alot of power lol just kidding looks great and wish i had a son to help on mine wife not into it for some reason:D[smilie=gun_chair.g:

I hear you on the square tire, but I figure after a few hours on the dunes I could get it rounded out!:D

K-fab
10-27-2013, 07:17 PM
Square tires - they're like paddle tires on a bike. Once you get moving fast enough, it quits being so rough. That's gonna require a lot of speed.

I think you need to start some new thread on some unsuspecting web site talking about the newest Square Paddle Technology and see who you can draw in. :cool:

Those Proto cars are CLEAN! I've always appreciated Jody's work. [smilie=bow.gif]

NinjaRaptor
10-27-2013, 07:24 PM
Square tires - they're like paddle tires on a bike. Once you get moving fast enough, it quits being so rough. That's gonna require a lot of speed.

I think you need to start some new thread on some unsuspecting web site talking about the newest Square Paddle Technology and see who you can draw in. :cool:

Those Proto cars are CLEAN! I've always appreciated Jody's work. [smilie=bow.gif]

Man, I bet I could sell a boat load of the square tires, the latest in square laser technology (SLT)!

Jody does good work, really easy to work with as well on a custom design. He lives too far away, but I keep trying to bait him in for a trip to the Oregon Dunes![smilie=mhihi.gif]

NinjaRaptor
11-10-2013, 03:36 PM
OK, the lights arrived and we have made a few custom brackets to tie into the frame and sheet metal. The pics below show them mounted to the XK1000, look pretty good. My son helped install them and did some light machined work as well. You can see him in the picture, the one that doesn't want to get out of the rail:D

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Also touched up the frame from the damage done by the shipping company. Got them to pay for the damages, but still irritating none the less. Sheet Metal roof will go out to have the powder coating redone also due to the shipping company.

The search for an engine kit continues, found a few guys that deal with this as a regular business. Might get a lead on one within the next week or so....

NinjaRaptor
11-12-2013, 07:52 PM
Good news! Found an 08 engine kit:D, working on the shipping arrangements to Oregon. Should have everything I need except for Fuel Pump, Ignition switch, and gauge panel. I can pick those items up after I get the engine installed and redo the wiring harness. Looks like I am going to need a schematic and most likely the service manual....

ProtoDie
11-13-2013, 06:46 AM
08 awesome! should bolt right in

here is a link to a free download for the service manual

GSXR manual (http://wotid.com/gsxr/content/view/22/43/)

NinjaRaptor
11-13-2013, 08:48 AM
Thanks for the link Jody, I'll pull the manual later tonight and check it out. Things are moving along, should have the sheet metal roof back from powder coat later this week. My son will help install it with the Cleco's and get some experience riveting it in place.

NinjaRaptor
11-24-2013, 09:20 AM
Got the sheet metal roof back from the powder coat shop, looks exactly like the rest of the panels. My son and I installed it on the rail, so that's a done deal.

Engine kit is shipping this week, should be here after Turkey time![smilie=jumping.gif]

NinjaRaptor
11-27-2013, 09:39 AM
Engine kit arrived, Christmas came early for me! I will start checking out the kit over turkey time, cleaning it up and getting ready for installation. Most likely have the exhaust Cerakoted to protect the pipes and get a little better performance.

NinjaRaptor
11-29-2013, 09:21 AM
Started going through the bits and pieces from the engine kit. Looks like everything is there and appears to be in good shape. Started cleaning it up a bit and giving some thought to the wiring mods I will need to do. Here's a pic of the engine.

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K-fab
11-29-2013, 04:11 PM
WOO HOO!

Wire harnesses - oh what fun!

Actually, I enjoy it... it is that wrong?

Martinm210
11-29-2013, 08:55 PM
Time for a wire diet..:)

NinjaRaptor
11-30-2013, 08:58 AM
Time for a wire diet..:)

That's for sure Martin. I am looking through the diagram at what are the usual suspects to eliminate, Sidestand sw, Tipover sensor, O2 sensor, etc. Seems like the entire turn signal/side stand relay can be eliminated as long as you bypass the instrument cluster neutral light ground to the gear position sensor.....more research to follow....looks pretty similar to the others I have done.

JGSturbo
11-30-2013, 04:05 PM
You should see the pile of wiring in my angry toaster lol.
I look forward to wiring my bike motor rail [smilie=lmao.gif]

NinjaRaptor
11-30-2013, 04:53 PM
Man, that must be one angry toaster!:D

As I work through the wiring harness, I am willing to bet about 30% of the wiring can be eliminated. Just keeping the core engine functions/sensors along with starting circuits and lights.

K-fab
11-30-2013, 06:49 PM
Don't throw ANY of it away...
Send it to me! I'm a Japanese connector junkie.
Trim all wires as long as possible and send me da stuff. :cool:

NinjaRaptor
11-30-2013, 09:04 PM
No sweat, let me see what I come up with as far as leftovers and I can send it to you. I may end up using some wire to extend the harness to the front for the gauge cluster and switches. Its that or I break out the "wire stretcher"!

Need to pick up a tool to depin the wires from the connectors and get things rolling on the harness. Didn't you recommend a tool somewhere here on the site? Can't seem to find it....

Bullnerd
12-01-2013, 08:12 AM
Its towards the end of my thread.

EDIT: I tried to find it for you but no dice. Maybe Kfab remembers where he recomended.

Edit-Edit...had it in my favorites....http://www.waytekwire.com/item/422/PED-ALL-PURPOSE-REMOVAL-TOOL/

NinjaRaptor
12-01-2013, 09:07 AM
Way to go Bullnerd! I thought it was in one of your threads but couldn't find it. I will get one on order along with a few other items.

K-fab
12-01-2013, 01:30 PM
Yup, dat's der one. Get two while you're ordering them. Oddly enough, you need two on occasion and it's a pain not to have it.

NinjaRaptor
12-03-2013, 08:45 AM
I'll order the electrical parts this week. As I started pulling apart the harness, I found one crimp that was weak, failed the pull test, and also found a few wires that had lost their insulation due to some sort of rubbing. Good thing I am looking it over, you never know what you might find and its best to find it now vs. in the rail:rolleyes:

NinjaRaptor
12-08-2013, 02:00 PM
OK, making some progress on the wiring harness and building a wiring diagram for future reference. I am bypassing the Turn Signal and Side Stand relay, no need for the extra wiring and sensor. For the most part, the LH Handlebar switch connector can be eliminated. I will be using the Clutch interlock with the clutch pedal. Hi Beam light will be an AUX power line. The fan circuit will be modified to support the dual fans. The relay is capable of supporting 20Amps continuously, both fans will draw about 14 amps worst case. I will also upgrade the power and ground wire to 12AWG to handle the load. Separate fuse holder will be needed given the stock fuse block appears to be rated for a 15 Amps max current. Also planning to eliminate the Exhaust valve acuator and O2 sensor.

For those that have done this before, here's a picture of the fun.....now lets see.... I am looking for a red wire with blue stripe, green dots, flames, and a chrome finish!:p

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rgvkid
12-11-2013, 12:46 PM
WTF! Thats my biggest worry about ever building a fuel injected car. Too much electrical! It doesn't help that Im color blind either!

NinjaRaptor
12-11-2013, 02:06 PM
WTF! Thats my biggest worry about ever building a fuel injected car. Too much electrical! It doesn't help that Im color blind either!

I can't imagine trying to do this if you are color blind.[smilie=shocked.gif] Its not that bad once you label the connectors, draw up a schematic and start working on it. I should have this wrapped up this weekend.

MrBracket
12-11-2013, 05:09 PM
Very sexy car Ninja! I hope to see it out on the dunes next year! What dunes do you usually frequent? Sand Lake? Florence? Coos Bay?

NinjaRaptor
12-11-2013, 06:54 PM
Very sexy car Ninja! I hope to see it out on the dunes next year! What dunes do you usually frequent? Sand Lake? Florence? Coos Bay?

Thanks, its comming along well and Protodie does good work. I usually go to Coos Bay, Florence is not bad, but too flat for me. I haven't been to Sand Lake in years, too many Life Flight helicopter rides came out of that area, almost every weekend. If I spend an hour more drive time, I can be in Coos Bay and have a lot more room to play and fewer idiots;)

Benihana
12-12-2013, 06:43 AM
Beautiful car, that will be fun for sure. Good luck with the wiring! Never seems to get easier for me...service manual...google...manual...google...manual...ah now I know where that goes..

Rat4020
12-12-2013, 06:55 AM
Ninja My bad for not checkin out yer tread sooner . Ya got a cool new ride goin on mighty fine on the fit ta finish :cool:

NinjaRaptor
12-12-2013, 08:47 AM
Ninja My bad for not checkin out yer tread sooner . Ya got a cool new ride goin on mighty fine on the fit ta finish :cool:

Thanks Rat, I appreciate the comments. Its also a good project for my son and I to work on. The wiring is not something he can deal with since he is too young for that, but he understands all the rest of it.

We will be ready to roll out 1st quarter of next year, with a bit of time to spare before the season starts on the Oregon Coast. That should do just fine to work out any kinks.

NinjaRaptor
12-12-2013, 08:49 AM
Deleted this since it was a duplicate of the above post, strange how that happened..........operator error maybe......rigafratz!

NinjaRaptor
12-15-2013, 02:50 PM
Wiring harness mods are complete minus a few small tweaks that will have to wait until the engine is in place. My son did the speedometer harness for me, actually followed the schematic I made.

I'll need to work on an extension for the harness to get the length needed to reach the front dash. Also have to give some thought as to the placement of the ECU, relays, etc. Might get one of those sealed NEMA boxes to handle that if space allows for it.

I stripped the exhaust valve out of the header. Amazing what you can do with a Dremel tool for those tight little areas! I will have to wait until next week to get the butterfly valve port welded up, then powder coated.

BajaInspired
12-21-2013, 07:08 PM
Ninja,
I knew you said this was coming but didn't realize you were already going at it. I know you got the manual already but here is another source for reference:

Service manuals for Suzuki GSX-R Motorcycles (http://www.servicemanualsgsxr.com)

Expensive light you got there. But I added it to my XL sheet anyway. Looking forward to seeing your progress.

NinjaRaptor
12-22-2013, 10:00 AM
Thanks for the reference Baja. The wiring is as far as it can go until I get the engine in place and start routing the harness. I have been ordering misc engine bits here and there, once the headers are coated I will install the engine and continue the harness routing.

Checked out the fuel pump yesterday, tested the sensor and fired up the pump which worked fine. I also test fit it in the fuel tank, only had to tweak the float position to get it to fit properly and clear the tank baffle.

NinjaRaptor
01-02-2014, 07:24 PM
I have several items in the works for the rail. Exhaust header and pipe should be coated by end of next week. I went with Titanium finish after talking with the company about what colors worked best for heat reduction. Turns out Black ceramic powder coat is best for thermal reduction, Titanium is next, so that the color I went with. Black is not my thing.

I have more electrical connectors on order that will allow me to extend the harness to the dash. Engine is in the rail (not in its correct spot) to help me work on it and get done what I wanted while the headers are being coated. Fuel pump is now installed in the fuel tank. Made a spacer ring between the pump and tank to ensure I get the proper o-ring compression. Tested the pump output and tank sensor as well (minor tweaks to get the full range in the tank) and they are both working as intended.

Progress, slowly, but surely. Pics below for reference.

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NinjaRaptor
01-12-2014, 07:10 PM
OK, got the headers back with the ceramic coating. Unfortunately, they did it in black instead of Titanium. They offered to fix it and do it in the color I asked for, but after the price break (black color) and the fact that the header cannot really be seen, I went with it. The Black also matches the black in the decals on the rail.

My son and I got the headers installed and mounted the engine in its proper position. Also connected the harness up to start kicking around routing options. I am planning to put a plate in right behind the seat above the head area. I have enough slack in the existing harness to mount the regulator, relays, and ECU to the plate. Makes it real easy to access these items and keep them out of the way.

Here are a few pics of the engine installed....the oil cooler is installed backwards for now. I just did that to get some oil in the engine until I get an aftermarket oil cooler instead. Still need to give some thought as to where to put it.....to get decent air flow.

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ProtoDie
01-13-2014, 06:53 AM
looking good Ninja

I strap the aftermarket oil cooler to the radiator.
Then the fan is always cooling it

this is what I use

Oil Cooler (http://www.protodie.com/Oil-Cooler_p_148.html)

I cut the stock oil cooler steel ends and weld these ends on to the tubes

Oil Adapter End (http://www.protodie.com/Oil-Adapter-End_p_153.html)

then run stainless braided oil hose / lines to the cooler

this also increases the oil capacity over the stock cooler

NinjaRaptor
01-13-2014, 08:58 AM
Hey, that looks pretty slick and keeps it out of the way. I will add it to the list! [smilie=thumbs_up.g:

NinjaRaptor
01-19-2014, 04:41 PM
Made the ECU panel and came up with a mount bracket setup that will give me a low profile for a cover (yet to be made) and keep the parts within the thickness of the Frame (1.5 inches). ECO is mounted with T-nuts that encapsulated (can't turn loose) in the aluminum brackets. I also cut rubber (EPDM) material as a damper between the ECU and brackets. The pics below show a close approximation of where the panel will go (will be shifted .25" up when finally mounted). Need to come up with a way to mount the relays that will leverage the rubber sleeve they come with from the OEM.

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Wheels
01-19-2014, 05:43 PM
that looks to be a good location... and i like the way you mounted it with the spacers. nice and clean.


EDIT: I went back thru this thread and didn't see any pictures... are there supposed to be pictures??

K-fab
01-19-2014, 06:15 PM
ruh-ro (in my best Scooby Doo).

I wonder if my programmer managed to move/remove/delete/modify some file that had pix? They're all listed as "Attachment" when I looked at the posts.

Wheels
01-19-2014, 06:22 PM
like i say daily with my work... back-up the db before ya do anything. lol not funny really.

K-fab
01-19-2014, 06:32 PM
I did!!!

NinjaRaptor
01-19-2014, 07:29 PM
There are (or were) several pictures to the thread. I still see all the ones I uploaded using the lustrious Fluid UI option. Try that and see if they are all there.....

Wheels
01-19-2014, 07:46 PM
I did!!!


i was only kidding ya. :D

i still don't see any. i'll check in later with another computer. maybe it's my laptop.

NinjaRaptor
01-19-2014, 08:28 PM
Hey Wheels, I just read your signature line, "learning something new everyday". That the same thing I tell my son, You learn something new everyday, sometimes you don't even know it:D

odypilots
01-20-2014, 08:34 AM
For me, the pictures early in the thread (square tire, etc.) aren't there, but from post #46 on page 5, those pictures show.

NinjaRaptor
01-20-2014, 08:47 AM
Odypilots, you are right about the pics as well. I just ran through the thread from the beginning and found the same thing.

K-Fab, can they be restored from the backup?

K-fab
01-20-2014, 07:50 PM
I don't know. I'll hit up my program guy and see.

NinjaRaptor
01-20-2014, 09:22 PM
Hey K-fab, I ran through the entire thread and found that the pictures still had the pointers to them in the db, but apparently no picture. I edited each entry and deleted the references, re-uploaded the pics again and entered them back into the entry. All is good for now. I would not want to that for a really long thread[smilie=banghead.gi:

No need for you to chase this issue down!

K-fab
01-21-2014, 05:22 AM
Whew!!

Thanks. Glad you got it all back up and running. [smilie=bow.gif]

Wheels
01-21-2014, 08:03 AM
yup, i can see the pictures now. that is one sexy beast. quick question though... when looking at the pedal setup, i didn't see any kind of mount for the actual throttle line... only one for the spring. is it behind the pedal??

NinjaRaptor
01-21-2014, 08:52 AM
Thanks Wheels, its coming along pretty good. Regarding the pedal setup, you can get a better view of it from the original chassis build thread, entry 43.

http://www.minibuggy.net/forum/projects-progress/18558-protolite-single-seat-crossbreed-xk1000-5.html

Its basically an small angle bracket with a hole in it for the cable. It sits just above the nut used for the spring return on the side of the rail where the gas pedal is located.

NinjaRaptor
01-25-2014, 05:45 PM
Spent some time this week mounting the relays, voltage regulator and making a cover for the ECU/Relays. Cover was made from .050" aluminum, all bent by hand and formed to fit the ECU/relays with a little clearance. Cover lid was .060" thick, assembled with rivets. Not too bad considering I don't have a press brake in the garage:D

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Next up, is mounting tabs for the cover. I was considering using internal tabs with J-clips so you can't see the mounts, but that would not ensure the bolts would stay seated. Most likely go with the usual external tabs with lock nuts although that may not pass muster with the Aesthetics Engineer (wife). Need to find a good edge seal material for the edge that mounts against the alum plate.....

Once I get it all installed, I will cut a clearance hole in the bottom to allow access for the cable harness

Benihana
01-26-2014, 08:46 AM
Dang..that took some patience!! Very nice:cool:

NinjaRaptor
01-26-2014, 06:10 PM
Thanks Benihana.

I found some material I can use for an edge seal on the cover. I am going to cut a section away in the mount panel to allow for the harness to pass thru, then work on mounting the cover with tabs. Once I have that, I can mount the plate to the frame and continue with the wiring fun!

MrBracket
01-30-2014, 02:07 PM
This buggy is coming along very nicely! Can't wait to see it on the sand this summer!!!!

NinjaRaptor
01-30-2014, 05:24 PM
You and me both! I should have the cover finished tonight, made some mounting brackets to hold it in place. Need to mount the plate back up with assembly before I locate/drill out the mounting holes......more pics later....

Wheels
01-30-2014, 10:44 PM
Thanks Wheels, its coming along pretty good. Regarding the pedal setup, you can get a better view of it from the original chassis build thread, entry 43.

http://www.minibuggy.net/forum/projects-progress/18558-protolite-single-seat-crossbreed-xk1000-5.html

Its basically an small angle bracket with a hole in it for the cable. It sits just above the nut used for the spring return on the side of the rail where the gas pedal is located.

thanks for the link ninja!

NinjaRaptor
01-31-2014, 08:43 AM
Sure thing, I am sure I will continue to post more pics of this build and somewhere along the line you will get a better view of the setup, with the cable installed!

NinjaRaptor
02-05-2014, 08:50 AM
Ok, I did some electrical work over the weekend. Built my own sensor eliminators for the Tip Over Sensor, O2 Sensor, and Steering Damper. I have a few pics below for examples. I used your typical bread board and resistor selection from Radio Shack. I expect I have about $1 per sensor in parts. I also finished the ECU cover and tested it, worked like a champ. I'll get some pics of that as well when the mount plate is attached to the rail.

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Bullnerd
02-05-2014, 08:55 AM
Pretty slick.

Hard to tell from the pics, but in the first pic, the two connections on the left look like cold solders?

mmobley
02-05-2014, 01:28 PM
Ok, I did some electrical work over the weekend. Built my own sensor eliminators for the Tip Over Sensor, O2 Sensor, and Steering Damper. I have a few pics below for examples. I used your typical bread board and resistor selection from Radio Shack. I expect I have about $1 per sensor in parts. I also finished the ECU cover and tested it, worked like a champ. I'll get some pics of that as well when the mount plate is attached to the rail.

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I wish I had your knowledge of electronics! Nice job.

NinjaRaptor
02-05-2014, 01:53 PM
Pretty slick.

Hard to tell from the pics, but in the first pic, the two connections on the left look like cold solders?

Good eye Bull, the pics are not that great. Sometimes the light in that little garage does no justice whatsoever. I checked the solder joints to make sure they had good bite. I also incorporated a strain relief (hole in the bread board) for the wires to ensure they had decent support.


I wish I had your knowledge of electronics! Nice job.

Thanks MMobley, let me know when you are going to leverage the GSXR1000 for one of your builds. I can share with you what I did for the wiring and help get you going.

Bullnerd
02-05-2014, 02:02 PM
Yeah I figured they were good based on the ones in the other pic. It looks likes two tinned wires barely stuck together in the picture.

NinjaRaptor
02-05-2014, 02:34 PM
I hear you on that, If you zoom in you can see the way the light was shining on the solder joint that makes the joint look weak. Heck, when I first saw the pics, I noticed they made the joint look bad. I would have taken a better pic, but the wiring is covered with heat shrink now!

BajaInspired
02-09-2014, 08:46 AM
I like the electrical work as well. I will have to do all this work at some point early next year.

Rat4020
02-09-2014, 08:56 AM
Ninja why are you runnnin a bypass on your O2 circut

JGSturbo
02-09-2014, 11:25 AM
X2, if there is any learning (no idea) in the ecu it might get funky.
But then again if it works its one less sensor to take a chit.

The last 20% seems to take forever... chop chop, summer's coming...:D

Bullnerd
02-09-2014, 12:33 PM
I used to work with a guy from Paraguay that used to say chop-chop all the time, havnt heard it in a while.

NinjaRaptor
02-09-2014, 12:57 PM
Ninja why are you runnnin a bypass on your O2 circut


X2, if there is any learning (no idea) in the ecu it might get funky.
But then again if it works its one less sensor to take a chit.

The last 20% seems to take forever... chop chop, summer's coming...:D

I ditched the O2 circuit for a lot of reasons. One, its a narrow band circuit and does little in terms of performance. Two, its used only in the higher gears and when you are in cruise mode. Three, its one more sensor I can get rid of, based on all I have read. I know there are two camps on this, but since I already removed the exhaust control valve, I figured I would ditch this as well. I'll know once I start up the engine if it was a good move or not (no FI codes). After that, the FI will get remapped.

Chop, Chop is right! I know spring/summer is coming, not to mention the boy needs to upgrade to a larger ATV. A lot to do to say the least. I have been working on wire routing this weekend in between the outdoor snow activities for Oregon!

You are right, the last 20% always takes the longest. Sometimes I put more thought into a solution than needed, but that's just me

NinjaRaptor
02-09-2014, 05:46 PM
Made a bit more progress on the harness routing (added angle bracket to overflow tank bracket) and attached the ECU plate with adel clamps. I am still thinking about keeping the clamps vs. welding tabs to mount the plate. If I get tabs welded on, it messes up the powder coated frame, which means paint touch up. The plate (still bare aluminum) will be powder coated Candy Apple Blue to match. I will add another adel clamp to the plate where the wire harness routes up to the ECU. That will act as a strain relief for all the connections (ECU, Relay).

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Need to give some thought to mounting the fuse block, might be zip ties to the wire harness, that's the easy way out unless I can come up with something else.....

K-fab
02-10-2014, 06:00 AM
I will add another adel clamp to the plate where the wire harness routes up to the ECU. That will act as a strain relief for all the connections (ECU, Relay).Good to hear. As I was looking at the pix, I was thinking "He needs to mount that loom."

The work looks great. Neat, tidy, fits well. Not easy, is it?

Duane
02-10-2014, 08:38 AM
I think the clamps look fine. You could paint the metal part of them to match the aluminum.

NinjaRaptor
02-10-2014, 08:50 AM
That's an interesting idea Duane. I think I will wait to see what the panel looks like powder coated and decide what to do then.

ProtoDie
02-10-2014, 01:49 PM
looking good Ninja.

I would go with the clamps too.

I think they look good and you dont need to mess with the powdercoat

NinjaRaptor
02-10-2014, 03:35 PM
Good to hear. As I was looking at the pix, I was thinking "He needs to mount that loom."


The work looks great. Neat, tidy, fits well. Not easy, is it?

K-fab, you are correct. There is always more work in the wiring than you think. Its one thing to toss it on there and hope it works, it's another thing altogether to make is last and hold up against vibration, strain, temperature, etc. I will be looking around for some wire wrap to handle the heat once I have the harness tested and working.


looking good Ninja.

I would go with the clamps too.

I think they look good and you dont need to mess with the powdercoat

I am thinking the same thing Protodie, once the panel is coated, I think it will look fine. The clamp colors sort of match up with the rest of the colors as well.

NinjaRaptor
02-19-2014, 07:50 PM
Made more progress on the wiring harness and routing. Wired up the dual fans to the harness and existing relay. Made a few brackets that mount to the fan shroud to support Adel clamps (hold harness in place between the radiator and engine). Also got a custom ground cable for the battery, the original was a few inches short. Ground cable is now 4 gauge instead of 6 gauge. Pics to follow.....

NinjaRaptor
02-23-2014, 09:46 AM
Got a few pics below for the fan wiring and aftermarket oil cooler installation. The oil cooler is placed just forward of the LH radiator using one of radiator mounts. I also modified the OEM regulator bracket to mount the bottom flange of the oil cooler to the firewall. Worked out well, very stout.

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bmanga
02-23-2014, 07:13 PM
Looking good! :cool:

TALON
02-24-2014, 03:51 AM
Very neat pro looking job ninja , might wanna keep an eye on the rec temp , I always try and put em in the open somewhere just in case . Anyway cant wait to see this rip should be a monster.

Rat4020
02-24-2014, 06:18 AM
Like others have said ,Very neat and clean build:D .. Its hard ta belive such a small oil cooler would make a diff . That sets the wheels turnin in my head for a cooler on my Apex .but mine has a small liquid cooled one next to my oil filter housing soo[smilie=dunno.gif]

NinjaRaptor
02-24-2014, 08:49 AM
Thanks guys, its coming along pretty good. I think the cooler will work ok given the air flow at this location. I'll be monitoring it once I get the rig up and running. Its a balancing act of placing the cooler at a location that will provide the decent airflow, but not stick out like sore thumb. The oil cooler for the coyote was up behind the driver's seat, not really in the path of the air when driving, but it wors just fine.

I'll get some lines made and install those this week. After that, its back to wiring again......

NinjaRaptor
03-02-2014, 11:59 AM
Made a little more progress on the wiring. Reworked the OEM connector for the tail light wiring and routed it back to the LED tailights. Used existing panel rivet locations and swapped them for small bolts and Adel clamps to hold the wire run in place. My son helped with the wiring/crimping and connections, glad to see him picking this stuff up as we go along. Once we finished, I hot wired the connector to the battery to test everything, worked like a champ and he got to see the results of our work.

Also took a picture of the starter relay mounting. I made a custom bracket and mounted it to the upper radiator mount, dual purpose. Routed the cables to the firewall away from the radiator. Its getting there....

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ProtoDie
03-02-2014, 06:45 PM
looking good Ninja :D

JGSturbo
03-02-2014, 07:47 PM
Those clamps look familar... I bet they come from little yellow bags ;)

NinjaRaptor
03-02-2014, 08:20 PM
Surprisingly, I got the from the local farm store around the corner. I have gotten a number of things from McMaster Carr if that's what you mean:D

JGSturbo
03-02-2014, 09:18 PM
Mcmaster had nice SS band ones for a good price. I swear I order stuff from MMC every other if not every day some weeks lol

NinjaRaptor
03-09-2014, 10:40 AM
Oil lines are finished and attached to the engine/cooler. I bought the engine fittings from NXP Motorsports to keep the oil line size at -8AN. Also leveraged a bracket from the original GSXR 1000 to mount the line to the frame as well as the brake line and provide some rigidity for the lines, like the idea of leveraging what you have on hand, saves time. Put the radiator on and everything fits as planned. A few of the pics are washed out from the flash, but not too bad.

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I installed the rear sub frame section, not really what I wanted to do right now, but we decided to move to another house. We have been hunting for a difference house for months, guess we are picky. At least it has room for a workshop out back!

This will throw a wrench into the build process, but hopefully only for a few weeks. Pics are below for reference. It will have to come apart again to install the transmission, but I have a number of things to do before that is needed.

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JGSturbo
03-09-2014, 09:30 PM
Looks great! I love putting on the panels and paddle tires for the first time...

NinjaRaptor
03-09-2014, 10:04 PM
I hear you on that, always looks better when you start putting all the parts on it!

NinjaRaptor
03-25-2014, 03:47 PM
Almost done with the moving process, should be finished this weekend. I am ordering colored wires to finish up the harness and extend it to the front of the rail. I found a place that has almost all the Suzuki colors needed, should have them sometime next week. That will put me back into the wiring side of things......then back to the airbox setup and installation.

NFG
03-25-2014, 10:00 PM
Nice work ninja!
When i first seen the XK on protodie's website i wasn't convinced on the look of the machine.... but man its growing on me!! cause i was seriously thinking of building the DXT for my 2nd build..... but like i said the XK is growing on me!!

Rat4020
03-26-2014, 05:56 AM
[smilie=ecstatic.gi: Man do I like the looks of that buggy Sweeeet and your fit ta finnish is about perfict

NinjaRaptor
03-26-2014, 08:49 AM
Thanks for the comments guys! I hope to get back at it after this weekend. My goal is to have it running for the Oregon Dune season which is getting real close. Still a fair amount of detail left to do....

JGSturbo
03-29-2014, 12:17 PM
Thanks for the comments guys! I hope to get back at it after this weekend. My goal is to have it running for the Oregon Dune season which is getting real close. Still a fair amount of detail left to do....
At least your motor is in 1 piece lol.:( Keep at 'er I might make the end of the season w/ new baby coming any day.

NinjaRaptor
03-31-2014, 08:59 AM
I read about the motor, bummer deal. Bet it won't take long for you to get another in there and hit the dunes again. Sounds like you will be very busy as well with the new baby coming. Congratulations! I completed the moving over the weekend, well at least all of my stuff is under one roof. Where exactly is still a big question....:D

NinjaRaptor
04-04-2014, 01:50 PM
Well, I got nailed with a cold after the move, go figure. Finally coming out of that and starting to move around again. I picked up a gauge cluster for the dash last night. Found it on craigslist, only 2400 miles on the unit. Looks like new to say the least. Will try to get to wiring up the harness extensions this weekend, at least a start on them. Crap, trying to wade through all the stuff in the garage is tough after a move!

Bullnerd
04-04-2014, 02:36 PM
Where did you move to?

NinjaRaptor
04-04-2014, 03:02 PM
That's the funny part, I moved 6 houses down the street. I was renting until we made a decision on what area we wanted to live in. Turns out, the house down the street came up for sale. It was a good deal, so we bought it. There is some truth in that moving a few houses away is harder than moving hours away. The so called packing effort is very different......and we are having some remodel work done at the same time, just to make things more entertaining.

Bullnerd
04-04-2014, 03:23 PM
Congrats on the new house.

Heres the real funny part...still dont know where that is? State would be fine if your worried about stalkers.

I could see the moving turning into "I'll just carry it down", then you get wiped from trying to carry every thing you own.

NinjaRaptor
04-04-2014, 03:38 PM
I am in Oregon....just outside Portland.

I ended up moving a lot of loose stuff, then all the big stuff in a moving truck with the help of a good friend. Its the loose stuff that did it...kind of like dying from a thousand little knives:D.....it just never ended...

Bullnerd
04-04-2014, 03:40 PM
LOL..yeah, thats what I was thinking.

NinjaRaptor
04-07-2014, 09:51 PM
Built 4 wire harness extensions to go from the engine compartment to the front dash. They cover the ignition switch, RH control switch, speedometer, Aux Pwr/Clutch Interlock. I used to the OEM pins, connectors, and automotive grade wiring with matching color scheme's for almost all the stock OEM wires. The new gauge cluster is shown along with the harness's below. I am going to pick up some hardware and cut a hole in the dash to mount the stock GSXR 1000 switch next.......

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ProtoDie
04-08-2014, 08:28 AM
looking good and congrats on the move.

if you take the back cover off the gage cluster and cut off the bottom plastic, you should be able to sandwich the front and back right in the dash cutout and screw them back together.

NinjaRaptor
04-08-2014, 08:49 AM
Cool, I will check that out once I get the ignition switch mounted. That has a bit of weight to it, so I might add a brace on the back of the dash panel to give it a little more support.

NinjaRaptor
04-27-2014, 06:40 PM
Got all the switches installed and gauge cluster installed, dash mounted. Started on the routing of the 5 harness's I have to run from the engine to the front gauge cluster. The one seen in the pics is for the instrument panel and includes the OEM connectors, pins, colored wires and expando mesh for protection. Hooked it up and ran a continuity check to make sure connections were solid (electrically) as well as double checking the connector/pin positions. Once I get all of the harness's routed, I will mount them with adel clamps to hold them in place.

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Duane
04-28-2014, 03:04 AM
That dash looks sweet. Did you engrave the switch labels?

NinjaRaptor
04-28-2014, 12:52 PM
The engraving was done by Protodie, looks better than the picture shows too.

Rat4020
04-28-2014, 01:03 PM
Man you got a clean build goin there Ninja . How long Till test & Tune day?

NinjaRaptor
04-28-2014, 04:28 PM
Hard to tell, buying a house and moving put a real dent in the budget/schedule. I am hoping to start it end of this month, but I have many little tasks left on the list to complete (water hoses, mounting airbox, pair valve, etc.).

NinjaRaptor
05-04-2014, 09:09 PM
Finished up the wiring for the instrument panel, got the routing cleaned up as well.

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Designed a bracket that will double as a mount for the pair valve and the protodie airbox. It mounts to the top of the valve cover via two studs that replace the OEM valve cover bolts (See comparison below). I used these studs when I reworked the airbox for the Coyote and that turned out well. They are designed/manufactured by King Sandcars. Bracket is not done as far as the final shape, but its getting closer.....

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Up north
05-04-2014, 10:23 PM
Ninja, can get a pic of the whole buggy? Im diggin' the blue

NinjaRaptor
05-04-2014, 11:05 PM
Sure, here's a pic that shows a side view during the frame build. There are more pics through out the thread and others at Protodie.com

Photo Gallery (http://www.protodie.com/Photo-Gallery_ep_53.html)

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Up north
05-04-2014, 11:31 PM
Simply an awesome looking buggy Ninja! So how does a person go about getting a protolite poster?

NinjaRaptor
05-05-2014, 02:50 AM
Thanks for the comments, it's coming along nicely.

That is a shot from Protdie's shop, my garage is not nearly that large, but I wish it was! Contact Protodie, I am sure he can point you in the right direction for a poster.

NinjaRaptor
05-09-2014, 02:21 PM
Got the airbox/pair valve bracket finished off, worked out pretty good. Now in the process of IAP sensor and installing exhaust. Ordered radiator hoses from ProtoDie, plan to install that next week. Getting closer to starting the engine....need to give some thought to priming the engine with oil since it has sat for a number of months. I can pull the spark plugs and spin the engine over with the starter to get things lubed, but that won't do much for the piston rings I suspect.....

Any suggestions?

fabdaddy
05-09-2014, 03:41 PM
pull plugs and put some oil in the cyl

bmanga
05-10-2014, 11:32 PM
Looks real good man! Gotta love neat wiring too! :cool:

NinjaRaptor
05-14-2014, 02:06 PM
Got the exhaust installed and made a a few brackets for the IAP sensor and fuse block. IAP sensor is attached to the ECU cover, made it look like it belongs there. Also got the radiator overflow hoses installed/routed from both radiators to the overflow tank. Its all the little details.......I will be working on the radiator hoses this weekend.

NinjaRaptor
05-19-2014, 02:24 PM
Got the radiator lines installed this weekend with pictures below ,including the exhaust installed.

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I am looking a adding a clamp (see below) of sorts to help mount the radiator hose to the frame section for stability. The clamp shown is a brake line clamp, but I might use one like this and mount it through the brake line hole to the frame, using the larger hole to hold the hose in place. I am open to other options.....

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I also need to give some thought about tying the two hoses in this picture together, adding a bit more rigidity so they don't bounce around to much. Any ideas??

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Duane
05-19-2014, 06:07 PM
What are the spec's for those hoses? Where did you get them? I think you are looking good with that clamp deal. For the brace clamp maybe some 1/2" plastic cut with inside radius ends and a band around all.

NinjaRaptor
05-19-2014, 08:22 PM
The hoses are SS 1" diameter hose, picked them up from Protodie's website. They worked well. If I can find a clamp about 1.5" for the frame mount, that will work fine. Hadn't thought of plastic for the other mount with two hoses, not sure how that would hold up to the heat though....I do recall seeing dual mount clamps somewhere, but can't remember where......

NinjaRaptor
05-21-2014, 07:43 PM
Started the electrical system bring-up process yesterday. Applied power to the system, checked for any shorts, no issues found. Turned the ignition to ON, Fuel pump primed, instrument cluster initialized, no FI code which implies the system sees all the sensors (and the eliminators I built) and so far has no issues. Also checked the lights and a few other things, operated as intended. I need to run through the owners manual and make sure I understand all the items in the instrument cluster and run through it a few more times. So far, its a good step to get to and closer to starting the engine. More to do before that happens......

NinjaRaptor
05-22-2014, 12:58 AM
Ran through the owners manual and outlined each of the instrument cluster functions, turned on the key and verified all are working as I hoped. One more step on the electrical done. Once I get a few more parts installed, add the fluids, lube the engine and cylinders, it will be ready for a real engine start.....after that, with any luck, a round or two of shots to celebrate![smilie=ext_beer2.g:

K-fab
05-22-2014, 10:50 AM
Woo hoo!!!!

NinjaRaptor
05-30-2014, 12:45 PM
Took a week off to attend a wedding back east and visit with family, then came home to a faulty water pump on the wife's jeep......If its not one thing, its another......

Once I get that taken care of, I can turn my attention back to the rail and getting the engine started...

NinjaRaptor
06-01-2014, 09:22 PM
OK, wife's care is alive again, so back to the rail. I filled it up with fluid (oil and antifreeze w/Water Wetter), put a little light weight oil in the clyinders and rolled it out for a first start......Yahoo.......runs well and no leaks or FI codes. All is well so Far[smilie=ecstatic.gi:

See video below, not the greatest, but good enough....

20140601 150902 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6un_rRIfhYc&feature=youtu.be)

Bullnerd
06-01-2014, 10:47 PM
You don't sound like any Ninja I ever met?

NinjaRaptor
06-01-2014, 11:19 PM
Couldn't help it, we are usually silent, but deadly....Ha!

You know how it goes, months of work on and off hoping that you didn't miss anything. Checking, rechecking, then finally turning the key.....

bmanga
06-01-2014, 11:21 PM
Sweet! Major milestone right there! [smilie=wbounce.gif]

Bullnerd
06-01-2014, 11:32 PM
LOL, Great job dude!

ProtoDie
06-02-2014, 12:39 AM
That's great. Always exciting when firing the motor for the 1st time

K-fab
06-11-2014, 08:43 PM
That first time fire up is always an ego booster. "Ya, it worked!" Nice job! The car looks awesome.
You gonna join us in Feb at Glamis/Ocotillo?

NinjaRaptor
06-11-2014, 09:58 PM
You know, I was talking to my wife about that trip. It might be a possibility, but it takes me 21 hours to get there. I really like the riding at Superstition Mountains, near the Seely naval air station. That time of year, you get front row seats to the blue angles 3 times a day!

On the XK1000, its basically finishing up the little odds and ends, controls, pulling the elec mount panel for powder coat, saving for the RPM,.etc.....the list goes on, but I getting closer!

Duane
06-12-2014, 12:12 AM
Your buggy is a thing of beauty! Proudly gleaming in the bright summer sun it beckons to the wretched MBN'er "Go fourth and shred the crap out of that sand!"

NinjaRaptor
06-12-2014, 01:40 AM
Damn if that ain't inspiring! Nicely stated Duane!

Rat4020
06-12-2014, 02:04 AM
Like he said DAM :D

NinjaRaptor
06-18-2014, 01:09 AM
Got the RPM transmission ordered along with the mounts. Hope to have it a month, then get it installed. In the mean time, I made some brackets to hold the radiator cross over hose in place on the engine cradle. Also got the throttle cable delivered, and cluch line along with fittings. Won't get to it until next week, headed to the dunes in a few days to have some fun with the family!

NinjaRaptor
06-25-2014, 01:45 PM
Well, we had a great time at the dunes as usual, except for the rowdy group of guys next to us that wanted to have a bachelor party at an RV campsite. Camp host put a halt to that one........

Here's a quick video of my son Jake on his new (used) ATV hitting one of the dunes. Its not a sandrail, but is sand related!

Jake's atv hill climb: http://youtu.be/VjEyOCTD6Ps


Back to the XK1000, started hooking up the shift linkage and clutch line. Will get the throttle linkage next and install the elec panel when its back from Powder coat. After that, its wait time for the RPM transmission.

NinjaRaptor
06-29-2014, 09:09 PM
Made some progress over the weekend. Clutch line installed and bled, checked clutch interlock at startup and works as intended. Elec panel back from powder coating, mounted the electronics and installed it back on the rail. Throttle cable installed and adjusted, gear shifter cable attached/adjusted.

Started it up and had only one small issue. Found a small water leak, appears like its the main line at the water pump. Maybe all it needs is a little tightening. It stopped leaking after it warmed up. I'll have to check that out later.

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elec panel is the one behind the head of the seat.

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elec cover is just above the airbox mounted to the elec panel.
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I noticed that while the engine is sitting running, you get a fair amount of heat coming up the electronics cover I built. I may want to put a few vent holes in the top to make sure that air can flow out as needed, something like a chimney effect. The downside is that stuff will get in the holes. Maybe some sort of vent fitting would do the trick......

ProtoDie
06-29-2014, 09:40 PM
that electrical box and panel turned out real nice.
:D
everything your doing is top notch.
your be throwing some serious roost before long

Bullnerd
06-29-2014, 11:25 PM
that electrical box and panel turned out real nice.
:D
everything your doing is top notch.
your be throwing some serious roost before long

Yup, very sharp!

NinjaRaptor
06-30-2014, 12:25 AM
Thanks guys, I am hunting for a low profile fitting that I can put in the top and act as a vent.

It looks like I found the water leak as well, I tee'd the overflow lines from the radiator to one line, then to the overflow tank. One of the lines had a loose clamp, the hard part was reaching it under all the wiring and other lines. After a few minutes of "Blue air" and a bit of bleeding, I got the fittings tightened.

NinjaRaptor
07-29-2014, 01:10 AM
Just got news that the transmission, rear brake parts, and misc other goodies are shipping my way. Looks like I will be busy this weekend!:D

bmanga
07-29-2014, 05:08 PM
I can't wait to hear it and see it in action man! :cool: Vids or it never happened! ;)

NinjaRaptor
08-10-2014, 01:23 AM
Got the RPM trans, mount kit, rear brake setup in a week ago. Finally got some time to install the trans, get the linkage setup. Axle's and CV joints are ordered. Here's a few pics of the trans and misc parts......

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MrBracket
09-03-2014, 09:44 PM
This thing looks like a show car!! Can't wait to see it out on the Dunes!!!!

NinjaRaptor
09-04-2014, 01:58 AM
Thanks Mr. Bracket, its coming along. I got the axles built and installed over the weekend, need to get a few more pics on the site to capture that work!

Rat4020
09-04-2014, 10:11 AM
Man that buggy is purtty :D like others said ,cant wait ta see vids

NinjaRaptor
09-04-2014, 12:58 PM
You and me both! I am working to get a run in with it before the rain really kicks in around here, but unrelated obstacles are getting in the way....

NinjaRaptor
09-14-2014, 07:18 PM
Been working on a number of things lately was plagued by a series of issues with the brakes, specifically bleeding the system. Some of which was my fault, others are lessons learned for next time. Food for thought.....

1) Do not use aluminum 3/16 brake lines in conjunction with an average flare tool. Turns out I found a few flared ends that would did not seal, the failure was the brake line split along the seam weld. A small hairline crack, but that's all it takes to have a leak and never get a stiff pedal.

2) Wildwood calipers will not bleed for crap unless both bleeders are at the top of the caliper, vertical. I removed one of the top bleeders (front wheels) and ran the brake line to that location ensuring line clearances at all ranges of motion for the front. I had to remove them, flip them in position, put in a spacer to keep the brake shoes apart, then bleed them one caliper at a time. Haven't had this issue with other calipers, but who knows.....

3) Rear caliper is mounted in a horizontal position, would not bleed for crap, see note 2 above. I ran a hard line for this caliper, thinking the bleeding issue would not be that bad. Wrong again, should have taken a closer look at the instructions on this. If I had, I would have installed a flex line for the rear brake. I removed the caliper, reoriented in the vertical position, bending the hard line at the same time (steel line for this one since the aluminum one ticked me off by leaking). Bleed the rear just fine after that.

I now have a solid pedal, moves about 30-40% before a solid pedal feel. I am giving a rest to me and the brake system for a few days, see if I spot any remaining leaks. If there are no issues, I will put the rear caliper back into position (bending the hard line again) and call it good for now. Somewhere down the road, when the rear brakes need replacing, I will get a flex line.......but not today.

My back is killing me, alcohol supply running low, frustration meter is running a bit high.......[smilie=banghead.gi:

Hopefully this information helps others out there.......don't make these mistakes on your build.

Bullnerd
09-14-2014, 07:58 PM
Yeah, I learned the bleeder goes on top in high school(80s)on my 67 Camaro disk brake swap! I was struggling to bleed the front brakes as my dad walked by ,took one look, and said "bleed screw goes up" without even stopping. DOH!

NinjaRaptor
09-14-2014, 08:05 PM
Yup, lesson learned.....I have made this work on other projects, but this setup would have nothing to do with it. Both bleeders up top, that's the only thing that worked.

TALON
09-14-2014, 11:05 PM
Ninja. on my rear brake set up ,, identical to yours . I have enlarged one of the vent holes in the disc so i can access and remove one bolt , rotate and loosen the other and swing the caliper vertical. Put in a bit of AL flat bar , which lives in my toolbox, and bleed . Also makes pad swaps easy .

NinjaRaptor
09-15-2014, 01:06 AM
Thanks Talon. I wish I had thought about this a bit more before I did the line routing. In hindsight, it makes perfect sense. I like your thinking about rotating the caliper up and bleeding it in the vertical position. When its time to do the pads on the rear, I will add a flex line that will allow that motion.

It's one of those things that I was in a hurry and had gotten by on this approach in the past, but it did not work this time around....

TALON
09-15-2014, 01:53 AM
No worries i know what you mean , i have always had the flex on there , but it is a bit of a pain to get the bolts out , being able to get at them through the disc makes it a true 5 min job . The best kind .

I have been meaning to mention it to Jody but have not .

NinjaRaptor
09-15-2014, 12:50 PM
The rear caliper has two threaded spacers between the caliper and the frame. I use two bolts for each spacer, for a total of 4 bolts to install the caliper. The spacers are bolted to the caliper, then the whole assembly is dropped into place and the other two bolts come in through the frame side and thread into the spacers. That holds the assembly in place. If I had a flex line, I would only have to unbolt the one frame bolt and loosed the other to pivot the assembly and bleed it.

TALON
09-15-2014, 09:38 PM
The rear caliper has two threaded spacers between the caliper and the frame. I use two bolts for each spacer, for a total of 4 bolts to install the caliper. The spacers are bolted to the caliper, then the whole assembly is dropped into place and the other two bolts come in through the frame side and thread into the spacers. That holds the assembly in place. If I had a flex line, I would only have to unbolt the one frame bolt and loosed the other to pivot the assembly and bleed it.


A gotcha , mine originally had one bolt through the whole lot , so i welded steel spacers to the cradle and used just 2 bolts , hence the need for the access through the disc.

Did not think of doing it your way , might go that way on the new one .

NinjaRaptor
10-05-2014, 08:50 PM
The chain is on, adjusted, and I made a simple chain guard out of alum angle.

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Picked up a shock kit and tank for filling the shocks with nitrogen. Ride height is set to 40% of full drop. Ended up around 170 PSI in the rear, 150 PSI for the front.

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Also picked up a couple of wheel dolly's to aid with the alignment. Caster and camber are done, Toe out is next, but I need to get some toe plates or flat plywood to finish that.

31160

ProtoDie
10-05-2014, 10:04 PM
looking great!

if you hook a tape measure off the steering ribs on the front tires....
measure front of the tire and back of the tire,,,, you can set toe that way too.

so close to a drive,,,,, awesome

NinjaRaptor
10-06-2014, 12:29 AM
That should work too, good idea. So close is right, I need to get the time to hit the dunes in another two weeks, weather permitting. Rainy season is coming....:eek:

NinjaRaptor
10-14-2014, 12:56 AM
Finished up a few things for the XK1000. I made a battery box and added a bracket to the top to help keep it in place. I found some J-hooks from McMaster that fit in a small space, but won't allow them to rotate. Might have to tweak this later on, but its good enough for now.

31212
31213

Also purchased some side view mirrors, CIPA 11160 PWC Safety 3.5" x 6.25" Mirror Sport II (Black), mounted them up with a simple aluminum bracket.

31214
31215

Now if someone would just call off the rain god fro a few days over the weekend, I can test the rail....

TALON
10-14-2014, 01:08 AM
Just an awesome looking thing all round,, great job .

JGSturbo
10-14-2014, 12:36 PM
http://www.minibuggy.net/forum/attachments/xk1000-single-seat-buggy/31213d1413269649-xk1000-single-seat-assembly-batt-box2.jpg
It'll probably be fine but such a nice car I'd hate to be dragging a battery...
I'd swap out the bolts for good threaded rod, nuts and possibly a hole for a cotter pin. Or drill the heads for safety wire.
At least take some jab nuts and loctite (washers on the heads to get more thread).
We all want to see this thing go so hurry up... and don't forget to message me [smilie=ext_shutup.:

NinjaRaptor
10-14-2014, 12:47 PM
Good idea on the battery box. I did loctite the bolts, but it might be best to add a jam nut or safety wire the bolts in place. I got time to improve it given the rain schedule.

I'll drop a note on this thread when I heading out to test it.

NinjaRaptor
10-14-2014, 01:36 PM
Just an awesome looking thing all round,, great job .

Thanks Talon, really chomping at the bit to hit the dunes, but Mother Nature has other ideas given the forecasted rain for the new two weekends....running out of time....:(

NinjaRaptor
11-01-2014, 07:06 PM
Reworked the battery mount so that the bolts are locked in place with a cotter pin. Also closed up the L-bolts for the top bracket so they can't slip out. This should take care of the battery.

31294

I have been watching the weather and it looks like there is a break in the rain this weekend. Packing up to hit the coast and finally try the XK1000. Most likely stay at Riley Ranch or Spinreel campground along the Oregon Coast. Really looking forward to the first run:D

JGSturbo
11-02-2014, 01:40 AM
[smilie=thumbs_up.g:

NinjaRaptor
11-04-2014, 12:35 AM
OK, reservations made at Riley Ranch campsite. Weather is looking good, low 50's at night, low 60's during the day and no rain. Plan to be there Sat AM through Tuesday AM. Will get some pics and video of the initial run to share with the site.

JGSturbo
11-08-2014, 02:55 PM
If you see this I'llbe aaround box car 10:30 for a couple hours.

NinjaRaptor
11-08-2014, 10:47 PM
Got to camp at 1:30, set everything up and went for a ride with the family. WOW!, this thing is a blast! :D Still keeping it low key for the first few rides. Need to adjust the chain, bump up the ride height a touch. Pics tomorrow if I can get them uploaded with the phone. Sorry I missed you JGSturbo,I will be here for a few more days if you get time to drop by.

JGSturbo
11-08-2014, 10:52 PM
Thats okay, was only there for 30min before losing a cv boot tie[smilie=gun_chair.g:

NinjaRaptor
11-09-2014, 01:21 PM
Those things can be irritating, had a few challenges when I replaced the one in the Coyote. Waiting for the fog to clear.....

NinjaRaptor
11-11-2014, 09:35 PM
Made a number of more runs on the XK1000, all went as planned, not to mention the grin on my face as I was driving on the dunes and beach. Pics and video to follow, had to book back home because of the winter storm coming through Portland area. Lots of fun with this rail[smilie=non_banana1:, looking forward to more trips once the weather cooperates.

TALON
11-11-2014, 10:38 PM
Excellent , great to hear , now about this footage dont 't keep us hangin too long will ya.[smilie=jumping.gif]

ProtoDie
11-12-2014, 10:56 AM
That's good news for sure :D
looking forward to pics and video

NinjaRaptor
11-13-2014, 01:01 PM
OK, here are a few pics from the recent trip along with two raw video's. One is at the beach, the other is on the dunes. Let me know what you think!

31318

31319

31320

XK1000 dune - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQMgcsMUdqs&feature=youtu.be)

XK1000 Beach - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K56toPKZhtc&feature=youtu.be)

ProtoDie
11-13-2014, 03:13 PM
very nice, looks fun.
car sounds good too

NinjaRaptor
11-13-2014, 03:41 PM
It does sound good, I had hoped that the single exhaust with the spark arrestor mod would work well, and it did. Its quiet and still sounds good. Another thing I found was the exhaust control valve is not needed. I designed around it and added an eliminator for the ECU. It has plenty of low end torque to move the car, the clutch is so easy to drive too. Lastly, the rear tires are working like a champ. They grab good, engine will turn them just fine, and no need to change the sprocket ratios at this time.

bmanga
11-13-2014, 07:13 PM
Sounds good and looks like some FUN can be had there now! :D Great job man! :cool:

TALON
11-13-2014, 07:49 PM
Excellent , so you haulin that bad boy down in Feb .

NinjaRaptor
11-13-2014, 07:53 PM
Still planning to do that, but the cost is going to make it tough. It really depends on how well the company I work for is doing as we get closer to that date. If it is better than we are doing now, I could make the trip.:D Otherwise.....not so much:(

chrisMX-15
11-23-2014, 05:18 AM
looks awesome man, came along way since I saw it last good to hear it run!!!!!!

NinjaRaptor
11-23-2014, 01:26 PM
Thanks Chris, it is a real kick in the pants to drive! I am mindfully watching the weather through winter, who knows might get another break in the rain and make a trip to the coast again.

NinjaRaptor
11-23-2014, 04:11 PM
Swapped out the rear brake line for a flex line that would allow me to unbolt the rear caliper and properly bleed the air out of the line. The brake pedal is stiffer now and not near as "spongy". The pictures below shows the line near the exhaust, but in fact has a few inches of clearance, not to mention a few adel clamps to keep it in place.

31497

31498

Also doing a bit of research on the possibility of adding a rear sway bar. The first ride out, I noticed the buggy rolls a bit more than I would like under tight turns at medium to high speeds. This could just be me getting used to the handling characteristics of the buggy, but I decided to do a bit of research and see if it can be improved without sacrificing the performance of the rear suspension.

I ran the calculations on the shocks with the current setup (oil/nitrogen) in comparison to maxing out the oil in the shocks. Found that will only improve the shock performance at/near the bottom end (fully compressed). Even then, it adds about 75 lbs of reaction force along the shock shaft, translate that in the roll direction and its around 25 lbs. Not enough to make a significant difference. So, now I am thinking about adding a rear sway bar, light enough that it does not significantly degrade the A-arm suspension. I have room to mount something at the rear like a torsion bar setup, mounted to the back end of the rail. More research to do.....

chrisMX-15
11-23-2014, 09:24 PM
Have you tried more air in the shocks? add little more air to the rear lot of weight on them with motor etc would be cheaper than sway bar and less complicated sway bar. Plus it will cut down on travel so you will need to find a happy medium. most 4x4 trucks jeeps etc disconnect sway bars for offroad. that is a reason I have not put shocks on mine yet not sure if I go coil overs or air shocks?. I have 4 rebuild able fox racing shocks off a sled with coil overs I want to try, im not really concerned about travel in Maine not a lot of deserts to fly over jumps, just woods and mud lol.

JGSturbo
11-23-2014, 10:07 PM
Air shocks are always a bit soft on spring rate letting more body roll. Even in the tight Oregondunes areas permit 50-60 but then you have to bring it down for the next trail.
We don't need ungodly articulation , more speed than stump climbing.

What's your weight?

NinjaRaptor
11-23-2014, 11:27 PM
Have you tried more air in the shocks? add little more air to the rear lot of weight on them with motor etc would be cheaper than sway bar and less complicated sway bar. Plus it will cut down on travel so you will need to find a happy medium. most 4x4 trucks jeeps etc disconnect sway bars for offroad. that is a reason I have not put shocks on mine yet not sure if I go coil overs or air shocks?. I have 4 rebuild able fox racing shocks off a sled with coil overs I want to try, im not really concerned about travel in Maine not a lot of deserts to fly over jumps, just woods and mud lol.

My ride height is set at about 45% droop to ensure tire clearance, I am running STU Blasters that are about 27 inches in diameter. I really don't want to add any more air to the shocks which would reduce the rails ability to keep all 4 wheels on the ground under all types of terrain. I am thinking the higher up off the ground, the more roll. I also share your comments about the potential impact to the existing suspension, hoping I can find something that is a good balance....more thought required....


Air shocks are always a bit soft on spring rate letting more body roll. Even in the tight Oregondunes areas permit 50-60 but then you have to bring it down for the next trail.
We don't need ungodly articulation , more speed than stump climbing.

What's your weight?

Buggy weight is 875 lbs without me in it, around 1050 lbs with me. I haven't actually weighed it yet, but I know the rolling chassis weight when it was shipped and have calculated all the bits (within reason) I have added to the build.

NinjaRaptor
11-24-2014, 06:51 PM
After reading the comment from ChrisMX-15, another option would be to run a set of coil over shocks on the rear instead of adding the anti sway bar. Any pros/cons worth considering on that approach?

bmanga
11-24-2014, 10:41 PM
NinjaRaptor, I'm curious of what PSI nitrogen charge your running in the air shocks and what the valving is. We run air shocks on are WEROCK rock crawling buggy and it weights 2100 lbs and u r much lighter. Air shocks can be tricky to tune. In our type of wheeling we do have front and rear suck down winches we can adjust ride height with but isn't a real option for your buggy. Plus to much nitrogen you will find in turns it is actually more unstable because as you lean they'll push further being so light! Push and then stick is another issue meaning it'll stay leaned like the shock has bad memory! LOL! We almost rolled a few times before I got our dialed in. Valving is a big thing to because I'm not sure about urs but our 16" Fox come valved for much heavier vehicles so we changed that too.

IMO though you'd be better off with coil overs for faster stuff. Air shocks for slow rock crawling stuff works well but adjustments are limited and we're not compensating for jumps, woops and such. Heat in an air shock in your scenario is a bit of a challenge too. With coil overs the spring rates along with progressive upper springs will allow you do accomplish what you need to easier and of course a reservoir shock allows for more oil thus cooling and far less shock fading that you may also be seeing with the air shocks.....

If you decide to go with coil over shocks let me know if you don't have anyone in mind to get them from. I have sponsors who pass on good deals to Team Chaos Racing (TCR) fans and I'd love to hook you up sir! :D

NinjaRaptor
11-24-2014, 11:28 PM
Hey bmanga, Protodie set the shocks up with 100/110 damping based on the testing he has done and they are set at 190 PSI. I would think the higher damping would slow the shocks motion during vehicle roll. I am running about 45%droop with me in the car, that allows for the clearance of the STU Blasters. Don't really think add more pressure will make it better, most likely worse. All things considered, it rides well under most conditions. Its the roll that bothers me a bit, hitting whoops at 50 MPH is not my bag of fun either. Having said that, I don't think the shocks are suffering from overtemp.

I have found a sway bar from Rath Racing that might be applicable, still measuring things. Also contacted Mark Sandtrans, local guy that sells Fox products. Surprisingly, both options will cost about the same in price......thanks for the offer with Team Chaos Racing though....you never know....

It seems coilovers are used more often that swaybars, and coilovers would offer more adjustment right at the shock without installing a swaybar (additional weight, impact on existing a-arm suspension?). Still thinking about it and need to measure a few more things to see what will fit and what won't......decisions.....decisions:confused:

bmanga
11-24-2014, 11:45 PM
In full size arena I play in Dirt Riot and Ultra 4 (KOH) feeder race series coil overs, bypasses and sway bars are king because of all of the fast stuff. Progressive coil setups work well and what we run even on smaller on Ultra 4 cars with reservoir shocks. Our Wildcat SxS/UTV is setup with a sway bar in the back and coil springs. We'll be adding bypass shocks. I would expect Protodie nows there buggy setups well! :cool: Keep in mind though that there is a personal preference to tuning also. Just curious have you taken videos of what it does in turns and such to show them? A video goes a long way and what we do when seeking someone more in the know than us on tuning....

Sounds like pros and cons in your scenario around swaybar vs coil overs are interesting. The only words of wisdom I'd give is if it were me and it's not I'd put a sway bar on it first and if that doesn't do what you want add the coil over shocks. I say that because we run both on our 1400 lbs SxS/UTV and it helps a lot and from what you describe it would help just how much is the question. I wish my sway bar was a bit stiffer too. This is on a 5 link trail armed Wildcat btw. The front doesn't use a sway bar with a-arms of course..... RzRs, Mavericks all run sway bars too. As you know they serve a bit of a different purpose than the coils on coil overs..... Also keep in mind the "spring" metal they use in the sway bars are not always equal. In our world some like anti-rock offroad sway bars and some prefer OEM like setups because they reaact much quicker and stiffer where the anti-rock are slower but adjustable to a degree. I'd be interested in knowing how much down force the kit you spoke of will provide to see if it negates the affects your feeling....

Maybe you should post vids for us if I've misunderstood what you've described...... :D

NinjaRaptor
11-25-2014, 01:09 AM
Good info, thanks! You are right, a lot of this is personal preference I suspect. The Coyote really has very little roll to it, but that's a different design entirely. The only video's I have are posted on page 19, post 189. I doubt if you can see much roll in them as we weren't so much focused on showing that maneuver, just playing with the rail and enjoying the fun. Wish I had taken another one showing moderate to sharp turns at speed. I have sent off more information to Rath Racing to see what they recommend. They use spring steel for the torsion bar, should hold up fine as long as you don't displace it beyond its yeild point. The trick with this will be where to attach the lever arms. They have a clamp that can mount to the a-arm, most likely somewhere on the rear of the top a-arm. That will put a bit of torque in the a-arm instead of centering the load. Engineers.....we always worry about everything:rolleyes:......You know the old joke....How do you know when the project is done........shoot the engineer!:D

JGSturbo
11-25-2014, 01:27 AM
Get a bar setup with the ability to re-position the links, that will get you some tuning.
A slightly heavier bar with the pick up points inboard will handle the travel better as far angles an such.
Links with heims or ball joints are best.

chrisMX-15
11-25-2014, 04:20 AM
really need to think how and where you ride most!!!! and its all personal preference not every one drives the same and/or wants the same out of their suspension this is first buggy I have built(still in process)ut I have built lifted jeeps with 35's numerous Toyotas with anything from 33's to 40" tires chevy trucks with leaf springs front and rear all had different suspension setups and all went off road and to truck shows(never built a trailer queen or will) read up on it too go to 4x4 sights get some ideas there too. jumping will need different set up vs. sand racing or mudding. all factory toys trucks etc are made with making money in mind with not the greatest durable parts they need to mass produce things so they are cheap and easy. I have built 4 different suspensions designs before I came up with the a arms I have now. less angles at pivot points and full adjustable for camber caster etc. so hopefully less carnage but never know I drive anything I have hard and put them through the paces. buddies think im mental but speed gives me adrenaline rush. I mentioned more air in shocks to try and see if it makes a difference for you it wont cost you a thing to try that that could lead to coil overs or something. I built a purpose built speed boat and those are not cheep to play with have to have a close budd willing to let you try his 400+dollar prop before you buy one or you punt or do a lot of research before sinking money into something that is not returnable and Fing expensive. Can Am and RZR's are set up diff but go for a ride at shop see what you think get ideas there too. I spend almost as much time researching as I do building. saves me money and mistakes (sometimes lol)

JGSturbo
11-25-2014, 12:11 PM
~400 per corner to swap them out (less reselling the airs I guess).
I like my air shocks and ARB, cars with coils (small short wheel base cars particularly) still install ARBs.
If anybody remembers the car Tom at tom pro built for him self - one trip and on the ARB went.
I need to make one up for my new car before all the junk gets in the way.

As far as attaching I'd go slightly outboard where he ties the 2 legs of the A arm together. It's a high leverage point for the ARB but even at max articulation the arb won't be seeing a ton of twist.

NinjaRaptor
11-25-2014, 12:52 PM
ChrisMX, I hear you on your comments. I started out building hot rods when I was 15, worked up to street/strip cars after that. All got too expensive, shifted gears toward offroad toys and have been at it ever since. I always do a fair amount of research, and calculations given my engineering background which helps. Not to mention this site and its members has been a wealth of information. For now, I am in the R&D mode working through the pro's and con's of coil overs vs. anti sway bar. To me this is half the fun, learning and designing.

JGSTurbo, I am thinking the same thing about the placement of the torsion bar lever arms and where they attach to the a-arm. The numbers I have calculated so far with one off the shelf ARB shows that it would work within its load range just outside the a-arm cross bar. I would rather attach to the center of the cross bar, than the rear of the a-arm just to eliminate any torque load. That would require a bit more creativity.....might have to sketch up a pic or two for review.

bmanga
11-25-2014, 01:23 PM
Suffice to say there are no "perfect" setups however there are better. As mentioned weight out the pros and cons and pick the best solution for your situation. Adding something here can affect something there so I'm with Chris on thinking about where you wheel most and fit the setup to that application aka your situation......

Also as mentioned you can see in the pic below of an Anti-Rock we use on fullsize rigs the different mounting points for the links. Far out = more suspension droop and less "immediate" sway control and the opposite as you move inward..... These of course are to wide for your application and by no means am I saying this is what to use for it.....just giving an example aka a visual on link mounts sir! :cool:

http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/images/pageimages/antirock1.jpg

NinjaRaptor
11-25-2014, 03:04 PM
Thanks bmanga, that is similar to what I have seen at other sites and I agree with the placement and reactive load by the torsion bar. Shorter the lever arm length, higher the reactive load from the torsion bar. Also need to match the allowable twist of the torsion bar to the motion of the a-arm. I ran the numbers using a sway bar from Durablue which would almost line up with the cross bar on the a-arm. Going on memory here, but at max twist the load on the a-arm at the cross bar would be 330 lbs, which translates to about 85 lbs at shock mount on the a-arm. This particular a-arm is Aluminum 7075 material. Albeit light weight, might not be the best choice for a torsion bar given how aluminum responds to LCF when close to its yield strength, which is not far from its tensile strength.....

bmanga
11-25-2014, 11:54 PM
Exactly! I use T7075 on all of my rods in the rear (pic below) but I can't imagine running as a torsion bar!!!! I can only speak from experience or what I've seen. By no means am I a material engineer....I'm simply a High-Tech Redneck, x "shop" teacher and professional computer person for more than 20+ years. LOL! In the last pic below look closely and you can see the rear sway bar on the Wildcat....probably not to applicable to your situation with a-arms though.....

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10653278_10205103507336148_7127191694930735982_n.j pg?oh=40d91b3d5639ee1664e31daffe1ee247&oe=54DC4240&__gda__=1423134125_d5b8c76910c1e9d144bfad8c3d12e5a 0

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10687186_10205470172142539_7963639271986918502_n.j pg?oh=5da26da448184ddf1e2f48579fc33ecb&oe=54DD89D2&__gda__=1427901357_94913069f2cf84d5ff61eb59ba86316 f

NinjaRaptor
11-26-2014, 02:17 AM
I agree, 7075 is good material, but given the range of motion and resulting torsional stress, I would expect fatigue to degrade the torsion rod. I took a look at the numbers with that sway bar, the load is higher than I remembered. It would be about 660 lbs load at max twist. I doubt it would ever see it, maybe only in the worst of conditions. Interesting setup on the Wildcat, what is the diameter of that rod? I am guessing its hollow as well.

Some of the torsion rods I have found run from .400" to 1.125", sprint cars seem to run around .550 diameter rods.

bmanga
11-26-2014, 08:40 AM
I agree! My radius rods are solid 1.25" T7075 and the heim's are 3/4 chromoly with custom width mis-alignment spacers. I had them custom made by one of my sponsors and no they weren't cheap even with his support! LOL!

A few more thoughts on the torsion bar is to have an axle shop that does custom work spline you one to your specified length out of spring steal. I doubt it would be cheap though. So how wide does it need to be? I'm sitting here pondering what trikes use in the rear.... :confused:

NinjaRaptor
11-26-2014, 12:46 PM
Removed duplicate of what is listed below......

NinjaRaptor
11-26-2014, 12:48 PM
I agree! My radius rods are solid 1.25" T7075 and the heim's are 3/4 chromoly with custom width mis-alignment spacers. I had them custom made by one of my sponsors and no they weren't cheap even with his support! LOL!

A few more thoughts on the torsion bar is to have an axle shop that does custom work spline you one to your specified length out of spring steal. I doubt it would be cheap though. So how wide does it need to be? I'm sitting here pondering what trikes use in the rear.... :confused:

That's a tricky question on the width of the torsion bar. There are a few factors that come into play that I have identified so far.

What is a reasonable load for an anti sway bar on a rail of this design?
How much angular twist and lever arm deflection is required to provide that load? Ensure that you don't over stress the torsion bar.
Given off the shelf solutions, can you match the sway bar required displacement to that of the a-arm motion, which locates the position of the lever arms and to some extent the width of the torsion bar (offset lever arms).
Is there enough space to fit the setup without interfering with the suspension travel as it stands now? Looks reasonable so far if mounted above the upper-a-arms.

NinjaRaptor
11-29-2014, 03:18 PM
Ran some calculations on the sway bar option and after kicking around the numbers, found the following;


Angular displacement is linear with effective torsion bar length
With a fixed angular displacement, increasing the torsion bar diameter will increase the torque and shear stress.


Design Guidelines

Torsion bar should be sized to handle full deflection (one a-arm up, the other a-arm down)
Resulting torsion bar load at the shock should not be larger than max shock force at full compression (bump)
Ideally, it should be designed so that the torsion bar load at the shock is some low percentage of the max shock force at full compression allowing the a-arm suspension to work as intended, independent.

That led me to a solid torsion bar diameter of around .5", spring steel material to handle LCF and alternating stress that the bar would see over its life. The shock load at max compression with my setup is around 780 lbs. Max torsion bar stress would run around 100KSI at worst case (one a-arm full up, one a-arm full down), I need to check the material properties to see if that's reasonable. In reality, it will never reach that since the torsion bar will restrict the a-arm motion and tend to limit the full travel. This at least bounds the sway bar design. The shock load at the shock mount would be about 250-400 lbs worst case (depending on lever arm dist to a-arm). Having that load transferred to the high side (inside wheel) of the rail in a tight turn would act to compress the shock and level out the rail. I would expect the normal load conditions to be more around half that, so 100-200 lbs at the shock, which calculates to about 2 inches or so of shock travel.

So, I am now looking at a couple of options for mounting and attaching the sway bar and lever arms to the a-arms. The pic below shows two options, one in blue, one in red. The blue is a short torsion bar setup that has the lever arms attached to the a-arm crossbar. The red shows a longer torsion bar (more angular deflection possible) attached around mid point of the rear a-arm section. The red circles indicate bracket mount points that would hold the Torsion bar tube. Going with the inboard setup, I might increase the diameter a bit since a .5" bar would not provide much load at the shock. Thoughts.....??

31623

JGSturbo
11-29-2014, 03:45 PM
Holy engineering LOL.
Go in-board, it really just needs to be a nice assist load.
1/2" is pretty small, maybe 5/8-3/4.
I'd make a nice long double shear tab to spread the load.

NinjaRaptor
11-29-2014, 04:42 PM
Holy engineering LOL.
Go in-board, it really just needs to be a nice assist load.
1/2" is pretty small, maybe 5/8-3/4.
I'd make a nice long double shear tab to spread the load.

Too funny on the Holy engineering:D

Inboard has an advantage of mounting along the a-arm crossbar (decent lever arm length from torsion bar to a-arm) and would require something like a 3/4 inch bar to get a reasonable load at the shock. Downside is that the I would have to use offset lever arms to keep a reasonable length torsion bar, but still get back to the location of the crossbar for attachment. Shorter torsion bar, inboard attachment requires a larger diameter bar (~3/4) to reach the same load at the shock in comparison to an outboard attachment with a smaller diameter bar (.5 inch).

Rath Racing makes a clamp adapter that would bolt right to the a-arm, skipping the welding for now to see if this would even work they way I want. Once I have it dialed in, I can add a double shear tab and make it permanent.

NinjaRaptor
01-13-2015, 12:17 AM
Got the mount brackets finished up for the anti sway bar installation. I have them mounting at two points on the frame to make sure they don't deflect under load, forcing the sway bar to do its work. They need to be painted or powder coated, but I wanted to assemble and test the setup before doing that. I purposely rolled the frame to one side to see how the sway bar reacted. It works well, put the body back where its supposed to be after I let go. When I did this before I added the sway bar, it would "set" to one side, leaning. The real test will be when I ride it next. Good news is that there are several adjustment holes on the lever arm link to change the sway bar load. Good enough for a test run when the season opens up....

31808
31809

Jerm
01-13-2015, 01:04 AM
DANG that is looking good! Did you end up sourcing the 1/2" diameter or did you go bigger?

NinjaRaptor
01-13-2015, 01:43 AM
Thanks Jerm, I went with the .5" diameter, its the same bar the use for the front of the razors. Seems like it should work pretty good and numbers I ran on the design seem reasonable, but testing will tell for sure. I wanted enough of a sway bar to eliminate the roll, but not to the point of significantly reducing the a-arm suspension performance.

JGSturbo
01-13-2015, 02:47 AM
Looks soo much better than my cobbled together torsion bar setups :D
Your gonna love it! My toaster needs MORE bar, leans a bit much for my taste.
Again good job.

NinjaRaptor
01-13-2015, 01:47 PM
Thanks for the comments JGS. I like the fact that its adjustable and I can tune it if needed. I'll be keeping an eye out for some good weather over February, maybe make a run for the dunes and see how it goes. I'll drop you a note when I do.

arrowhead
01-22-2015, 12:31 AM
Hi Ninjaraptor
I got dizzy with all the sway bar calcs
I got a swayaway for a beetle took 5 inches out of the centre and it's still there.
Yours looks very good!
If you are planning a trip to Florence I'm only 2 minutes away so I'm always ready but we are leaving for Glamis next week but be back early April so let me know
Dale

NinjaRaptor
01-22-2015, 01:42 AM
Thanks arrowhead, I hear you on the calcs, makes me a bit dizzy as well. I know more now that I ever needed on sway bar loads.....

I'll drop you a note next time I am headed to Coos Bay. Can't believe the coast weather this weekend, 72F on Sunday in January!

Enjoy the Glamis trip, I plan to go next year with the family.

Bansheebrigade
01-24-2015, 02:33 AM
Wow, sweet buggy! I love the proto frames. I have rode horsefall, winchester, florence etc quite a bit and have never really seen any mini's. Seems like a blast though, I wish I had the $$.

NinjaRaptor
01-24-2015, 02:03 PM
Thanks Jarrett, Protodie has done a solid job on the design and the first trip out was a blast. Protodie worked with me on the changes I wanted in the frame to narrow it up a bit and leverage the designs of the DXT1000 and XK450R. I wanted something that would get around the Oregon dunes just as much as a side x side, but with better power and suspension. It all works like a champ. Save up the money and build most of it yourself, that's the most cost effective way to do it.

JGSturbo
01-24-2015, 05:34 PM
Next weekend looks go so far... we just bought a new camper so we got to got to test it out at boxcar campground.:D

NinjaRaptor
01-24-2015, 10:56 PM
Congratulations on the camper! We are keeping an eye on the weather as well. Next trip is an ATV trip since we didn't get to do much of that last year. The 250R is in need of a hard run weekend along with the Ninja Raptor. I'll drop you a note if we can pull it off.

NinjaRaptor
05-11-2015, 03:47 PM
Got to make another trip to the dunes with the XK1000 and the new anti sway bar setup. It works like a champ, didn't even have to adjust the linkage. It still allows for full travel, but applies just enough load to reduce the roll a bit to my linking. I hit it pretty hard on a lot of tight turns and the vehicle roll was comfortable. Also had quite a number of onlookers as I hit a few steep hills at speed. Man that engine sounds good when its at 10,000 RPM!