found this disturbing when i read it today

[LiveWire]

I believe McCain was born on a military base which is considered part of the US and therefore is a non-issue.

[shinear]

Important stuff you bet, neither side has a good candidate...so vote for the side that will give you lower taxes and less government intrusion...I'm from Nevada and am truly embarrassed that we are represented by the biggest idiot in the game today.....harry reed.

In my opinion it transcends Democrat or Republican....liberalism is going to FUCK us all...stand on you own 2 feet and work hard for what you got and then some ass gives it away, I don't think so. (liberalism = socialism)

Oh and if you what to stop the hoax of global warming...shoot a lib with that gun they are working to take away from you.....Opps sorry here I go again on the soapbox....sorry.

I love buggies as much as anybody but even though this is not the place to discuss it , nothing IS more important for us all......we need to keep this the best country in the world, go USA.

Shine

I'll vote for TED

[masterfabr]

I hired 2 people and allowed them to give their present employers 2 weeks notice.The thanks I got was that 1 didn't even show up Monday and the other one lasted 1.5 days and just walked out without saying a word to anyone.American workers are becoming the most worthless ,spoiled rotten,irresponsible,lazy,whining,crybabies in the fucking world. Another one was supposed to be here this morning and was a no show.WHY???? He's 25 years old,sat on a mower for 5 hours yesterday and said he must have gotten dehydrated so he couldn't work today.Damn BABY!!!!! I'm 52 fricken years old.I worked the last week 12 hours a day in the fricken sun with no shade framing shop addition and did I miss working the next day????NOOOO. So why couldn't the BABY 25 year old handle it?????? GD spoiled rotten whining,crybaby American way of life. It's going to be the ruination of us all.Plain and simple.

[jumpin jellybean]

Amen to that I get lazy sometimes but that just means I have even more work to do later

[N8ball]

Phew. Talk about a lot of info. I guess there would have been more if all the reference links worked. Also, if all the numbers added up to the one at the bottom it would have made a little more sense. As most of the "evidence" was taken as excerpts from a transcriprt, there is no link to actual data on many of the claims. Making them hard to verify.

One line (of thousands) I found interesting was-
"LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening everybody I'm Lou Dobbs in Cancun, Mexico where the tri-lateral summit has just concluded. President Bush, once again, calling for a guest worker amnesty program, a program that Mexican President Vicente Fox embraces and applauds, and most Americans outright oppose." How do all you RED blooded Americans feel about how our Pres is handling\has handled the current immigration situation?

Also, I understand the high cost to our society of illegal immigration (supposedly 300 some billion annually), but the cost of this war is nearly the same. Whether or not you agree with the war, the $750 million a day price tag seems pretty hard to justify. (This figure accounts for actual costs plus interest paid on loans, remember, we are still paying off WWII.) Especially when you consider why we went over there to begin with(lies).

Another thing to think about would be the cost of goods and services that we are currently used to. In this Low Prices Gauranteed WAL MART nation, are consumers ready to pay more for identical products, just because they were made by a "real American"? I think not. In reality, we risk losing even more of our manufacturing facilities to countries with no/low wage standards. I am a huge supporter of local business, even if that means paying a little more. Typically, the service is much better, and I appreciate that.

I honestly believe that our economy would suffer an enourmous hardship if suddenly a large percentage of our low wage earners were deported.

Our country was "founded" by illegal aliens, And frankly, where would you be if the Real (Native) Americans had deported your ancestors? Rant over.

[masterfabr]

So what you're saying is that we should all be making minimum wage and we should all be struggling to buy the cheap imported stuff? That's the end result of "gotta buy cheap" at all costs because the only way it gets to be cheap is by screwing the little guy out of a decent wage so we can sell it cheaper to the guys making minimum wage. Want to enjoy the American way of life? Then you'd better start supporting it or accept the consequences as we slide lower and lower in our standard of living.

[N8ball]

Fabr- Not sure if that was directed at me but if you got that from my post you, maybe you should re-read it. I never said we should all make minimum wage, or that we should all struggle to buy the cheap crap. Personally I think we should all re-evaluate our wants vs. needs, and make informed decisions on our purchases based on what is the actual cost. Not only the out of pocket expenses, but also the cost to society, and as kooky as it may sound to some, the environmental impact. I absolutely disagree with the viewpoint that price is the most important issue when making any purchase.

I understand that illegal immigrants play a pivotal role in our economy. Just up and deporting them could potentially cause more harm than good. As in the case with any issue invloving millions of people and a complex society of individual cultures, the answer to problems is not ever black and white.

I am just putting another point of view out there, that was not represented in other posts. I know it is tough to make informed decisions when our opinions are skewed by misleading propaganda, like the post that started all this. Not everyone has time or desire to explore the truth, and it is much eaiser to just get in line with all the other Sheeple. I would be interested to know what percentage of responders here checked out the reference links. I know I didn't read them all but at least enough to realize it was not all raw data. A comment by some political blowhard in an interview is not exactly the TRUTH.

I don't pretend to have any answers, or solutions, but due to my open mind, I try to understand viewpoints that I may disagree with.

Have a good weekend! I've got some tubes to bend.

[masterfabr]

Originally Posted by N8ball

Phew. Talk about a lot of info. I guess there would have been more if all the reference links worked. Also, if all the numbers added up to the one at the bottom it would have made a little more sense. As most of the "evidence" was taken as excerpts from a transcriprt, there is no link to actual data on many of the claims. Making them hard to verify.

One line (of thousands) I found interesting was-
"LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening everybody I'm Lou Dobbs in Cancun, Mexico where the tri-lateral summit has just concluded. President Bush, once again, calling for a guest worker amnesty program, a program that Mexican President Vicente Fox embraces and applauds, and most Americans outright oppose." How do all you RED blooded Americans feel about how our Pres is handling\has handled the current immigration situation?

Also, I understand the high cost to our society of illegal immigration (supposedly 300 some billion annually), but the cost of this war is nearly the same. Whether or not you agree with the war, the $750 million a day price tag seems pretty hard to justify. (This figure accounts for actual costs plus interest paid on loans, remember, we are still paying off WWII.) Especially when you consider why we went over there to begin with(lies).

Another thing to think about would be the cost of goods and services that we are currently used to. In this Low Prices Gauranteed WAL MART nation, are consumers ready to pay more for identical products, just because they were made by a "real American"? I think not. In reality, we risk losing even more of our manufacturing facilities to countries with no/low wage standards. I am a huge supporter of local business, even if that means paying a little more. Typically, the service is much better, and I appreciate that.

I honestly believe that our economy would suffer an enourmous hardship if suddenly a large percentage of our low wage earners were deported.

Our country was "founded" by illegal aliens, And frankly, where would you be if the Real (Native) Americans had deported your ancestors? Rant over.

I agree with 99% of that.

There's no way we can or will deport those already here.I vehemently oppose the continuation of the influx of illegals though.

Our founding fathers were not illegal immigrants.There were no laws against them coming here. They may have been unwanted but they broke no laws in coming here.BTW the American Indians were not the first people here.We are however still paying for what we took from the American Indians ,allow them to have sovereign nations within our borders and have a casino on every corner. When are the modern day illegals going to make the same deal for us the legitimate citizens of the U.S.?

[whiplash]

Originally Posted by N8ball

Phew. Talk about a lot of info. I guess there would have been more if all the reference links worked. Also, if all the numbers added up to the one at the bottom it would have made a little more sense. As most of the "evidence" was taken as excerpts from a transcriprt, there is no link to actual data on many of the claims. Making them hard to verify.

One line (of thousands) I found interesting was-
"LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening everybody I'm Lou Dobbs in Cancun, Mexico where the tri-lateral summit has just concluded. President Bush, once again, calling for a guest worker amnesty program, a program that Mexican President Vicente Fox embraces and applauds, and most Americans outright oppose." How do all you RED blooded Americans feel about how our Pres is handling\has handled the current immigration situation?

Also, I understand the high cost to our society of illegal immigration (supposedly 300 some billion annually), but the cost of this war is nearly the same. Whether or not you agree with the war, the $750 million a day price tag seems pretty hard to justify. (This figure accounts for actual costs plus interest paid on loans, remember, we are still paying off WWII.) Especially when you consider why we went over there to begin with(lies).

Another thing to think about would be the cost of goods and services that we are currently used to. In this Low Prices Gauranteed WAL MART nation, are consumers ready to pay more for identical products, just because they were made by a "real American"? I think not. In reality, we risk losing even more of our manufacturing facilities to countries with no/low wage standards. I am a huge supporter of local business, even if that means paying a little more. Typically, the service is much better, and I appreciate that.

I honestly believe that our economy would suffer an enourmous hardship if suddenly a large percentage of our low wage earners were deported.

Our country was "founded" by illegal aliens, And frankly, where would you be if the Real (Native) Americans had deported your ancestors? Rant over.

I see your point on the wall mart thing, but the fact is MANY other countries don't allow major importing to the extent we do, and block immigration as well unless you have a service or goods that will benefit the country. I think if we blocked our borders heavily and stopped the influx of illegals and began getting the existing ones papered so they can pay taxes like the rest of us, things would improve. As for the Wall Mart thing, we simply make it impossible for them to bring goods into our country without a large tariff to make it impossible for them to out price our American companies, problem solved, you don't have cheap chineese stuff available any more so you have to buy AMERICAN, no choice!! Americans are fat, lazy and want everything on a platter,I admit it I AM EVEN SUCKED IN AT TIMES but I say we make the country what it used to be, a home for hard working, intelligent, successful people, not a catch all nation for the crap other countries don't want! Sorry, I am finished...

[masterfabr]

Originally Posted by whiplash

I see your point on the wall mart thing, but the fact is MANY other countries don't allow major importing to the extent we do, and block immigration as well unless you have a service or goods that will benefit the country. I think if we blocked our borders heavily and stopped the influx of illegals and began getting the existing ones papered so they can pay taxes like the rest of us, things would improve. As for the Wall Mart thing, we simply make it impossible for them to bring goods into our country without a large tariff to make it impossible for them to out price our American companies, problem solved, you don't have cheap chineese stuff available any more so you have to buy AMERICAN, no choice!! Americans are fat, lazy and want everything on a platter,I admit it I AM EVEN SUCKED IN AT TIMES but I say we make the country what it used to be, a home for hard working, intelligent, successful people, not a catch all nation for the crap other countries don't want! Sorry, I am finished...

I agree.