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Driveline Mini-buggy transmission, differentials, Forward Neutral Reverse (FNR) and gearing discussions.

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Old 02-26-2007, 07:11 PM   #1 (permalink)

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Default max angle for 930 cv

What is the max angle you feel comfortable running with 930 cv's. *What about aftermarket cages, are they neccessary? do they increase max angle? which ones do you like? *

I'm trying to skip the learn by doing/breaking method and just get something that works. *its going in a single seat cbr 929 powered mini rail. *With my track width and desire ground clearance, the more max angle = more travel I can get. *I've read the threads about the u-joint half shafts but want to know about whats the best 930 cv set up.

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Old 02-26-2007, 07:32 PM   #2 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

I would not run more than 24* with a fully race prepped CV. *I bought the race prepped CV's from Gary @ B&R Buggy.
They are the ones that EMPI sells with the fins cut into the body and the moly cages. *They are probably not as good as the GKN ones but they were less expensive by alot. *They seem to be doing just fine @ 24*.

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Old 02-26-2007, 08:31 PM   #3 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

You have other options too, especially if you have yet to purchase your axles.

RCV Performance will make you some front wheel drive CV plunging axle half shafts for less than you would think. Mine cost $435 per side - complete. Max angle is 40* or more.

Lot's of people seem happy with U-joints. No matter what you end up with you have to perform preventive maintenance and everything has a failure rate. Other considerations like U-joint oscillation and shaft separation dangers are debatable.

Contact Sean at RCV Performance if interested. Mine are the first set they are producing with 930 FWD CV plunging axles. Check their website keeping in mind that this specific product is not depicted.
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Old 02-27-2007, 12:42 AM   #4 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

22 is safe on a 930. *You can push 23-24, but expect to replace them often and make sure you constantly check the cages. *The cages are what usually let go.

When you over angle the axle, it forces the balls to push against the webbing in the cages. *As the CV turns, it will force the balls to smash against the webbing on one side, while pushing the balls against the webbing (expanding) on the opposite side. *The cage goes pop, the balls leave the CV (usually thru the boot) and then you have a nice greasy mess all over the back of your car. (CV grease is NASTY too...) *Super Cages have wider windows in the cage and are precision spaced so the balls all make contact at the same time, spreading the load a bit better. *Regular cages aren't always as precise, so you can end up with one ball that bottoms out sooner than the others - stress point and pop are the results.

Gear One's Super Cages claim 27, but they click like mad after 24. *They are nice units, though.

Check my thread on my [url=http://www.minibuggy.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1088&post days=0&postorder=asc&start=60:3irmnw6g]Class 10 desert car build[/url:3irmnw6g]. *I installed a new set of plunging axles with 930, non-plunging CVs this morning. *40 degrees. *At the 26 degrees that the axles are sitting during full droop, they are smooth as glass and have absolutely no bind. *I'll be posting pics in just a few minutes.
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Old 02-27-2007, 04:58 AM   #5 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

Gene- Thanks I'm waiting for a call back from them, the price sounds good.

Kfab- are those the same set up that Gene is talking about? *A long time ago I spoke with the GKN/lobro motorsports rep about this issue, he had a non plunging size 14 cv which was similar in size/strength to a 930, the problem was that it had a welded flange on it that spaced the face out about 3in. from the pivot point. which ate up axle length forcing high angles. *The boot was good to 40 degrees and the joint to 45 degrees. *They were also very expensive over $300 a cv, they also made a nice coated slip spline, which kinda looks like the one your useing, is it the same? I told him that they should make a pancake style joint out of their size 14 and drill it for a 930 bolt circle. *Evidently lobro considers an order below several thousand pieces too small. *I wonder if someone did that and thats what you have? *Who did you buy them from, if you don't mind me asking, how much $$$$ ?

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Old 02-27-2007, 05:10 AM   #6 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

As stated in my post above, check the highlited [url=http://www.minibuggy.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1088&post days=0&postorder=asc&start=60:310rzruq]Class 10 desert car build[/url:310rzruq] thread. *All the info I know about the axles is there.
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Old 02-27-2007, 07:14 AM   #7 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

GKN-Lobro do a Type 116 slip joint, but it's the normal spline-on-spline type of affair. It doesn't have the linear bearing constituent.

They also make a Type 166 weld stub shaft with which you could make your own ball bearing slip shaft. If you got a suitably sized linear shaft and welded one of the Type 166 stubs and CVs to each end of it, you'd have the exact same unit as K-fab has. They're not too expensive, but you'd want to have them professionally welded - unless you happen to be a particularly good welder!

As Gene said, there are down sides to driveshaft type half shafts and if they disintegrate they can cause mayhem. If you don't grease them daily and change the grease regularly, they'll cause problems especially the closer to their limit you push them. They'll always bind to some degree - even when they're freshly greased. When they do bind, they'll try and push the final drive out of the chassis and they'll try and push the trailing arms outwards. Trailing arm pivot breakages aren't uncommon.

I used slip joint half shafts for a number of years and was determined to get them to work as I wanted the travel they appeared to offer. They needed a lot of care and attention and did cause peripheral damage. It would be wise to beef up all the rear end components to limit any possible damage. I spent a small fortune on those shafts and eventually gave up on them in favour of a jack shaft system and conventional CVs and axles.
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Old 01-16-2012, 07:48 PM   #8 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

Which 930 joint do you use to get 40 degrees? Also curious who makes the axles as this set up is something I may do also
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Old 01-16-2012, 08:34 PM   #9 (permalink)

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Default Re: max angle for 930 cv

Quote:
Originally Posted by gearheadc View Post
Which 930 joint do you use to get 40 degrees? Also curious who makes the axles as this set up is something I may do also
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene View Post
RCV Performance will make you some front wheel drive CV plunging axle half shafts for less than you would think. Mine cost $435 per side - complete. Max angle is 40* or more.

Contact Sean at RCV Performance if interested.
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