external oil cooler??

[masterfabr]

Originally Posted by railcrzy\";p=\&quot

Well the shop said " my valves need adjusting" $300. Then when they went to tune in the power commander 3 cylinders compression was i think he said 175 and should be around 155 or 160 and the last cyl.. was lower than what it should be.

Could the valves be out far enough to cause all that?? "hi and low compression change and hi temp?

larry

Yes they could be the cause and if it's not been run long like that they may only need adjusting.The shop should have done a cylinder leakage test to determine if the valves are just out of adjustment or if the exhaust seat is burnt on the low cylinder.The higher compression readings are most likely from carbom build-up and would tend to make me suspicious of a burned ex seat and or valve on the low cylinder.fabr.

[masterfabr]

Originally Posted by railcrzy\";p=\&quot

Well the shop said " my valves need adjusting" $300. Then when they went to tune in the power commander 3 cylinders compression was i think he said 175 and should be around 155 or 160 and the last cyl.. was lower than what it should be.

Could the valves be out far enough to cause all that?? "hi and low compression change and hi temp?

larry

Yes they could be the cause and if it's not been run long like that they may only need adjusting.The shop should have done a cylinder leakage test to determine if the valves are just out of adjustment or if the exhaust seat is burnt on the low cylinder.The higher compression readings are most likely from carbom build-up and would tend to make me suspicious of a burned ex seat and or valve on the low cylinder.fabr.

[masterfabr]

Originally Posted by Rorty\";p=\&quot

Why risk destroying the engine? If it ran an oil cooler in stock form, then in a buggy, you owe it to the engine to run a cooler at least as large as the stock one. Even if the water temp reads within limits without the oil cooler plumbed in, you would still probably be causing engine damage.

The oil cooler works in unison with the radiator, and both are essential to the health of the engine. Running an oversized radiator solely will not provide the same degree of cooling or protection.

I don't understand your concerns of breaking the cooler. If it's sensibly located and correctly plumbed in, there's no reason why it should be a liability. Ducting air to a radiator or oil cooler in a buggy is usually a sure way to destroy them. I've seen rads and coolers that were mounted "out of harm's way" but with ducts to divert cool air towards them. All that seems to happen is that stones are funnelled into the cores and destroys them quicker than if they were located in clean air without ducting.

Ducting works fine for on-road cars, but in my experience of off-road racing, ducts are a death knell.

Rorty I fully agree with all that you said about needing the oil cooler I was just wanting to know if the large radiator could possibly be keeping the oil temps at normal levels without the use of an oil cooler on an engine that the factory felt was needed or the money wouldn't have been invested in one in the first place. .I doubt it but yoshi said he didn't need it and wondered if it had actually been monitored or if it was just a "cause I know so" statement.I feel that an oil cxooler is very beneficial at maintaining correct overall engine temps.I've spent a lot of time on dynos with theV-8 Drag motors and I can say without a doubt an oil cooler will lower water temps on most big engines anyway.Most are extremely tough even if bent up and will be no problem.I'm really not too worried about a radiator failure but I will still mount it low and rear on the next build.A proper shrouding I feel is possible that will allow unrestricted airflow and yet prevent debris damage to it.A 90 degree route with a bottom drop out for debris to fall out before it gets to the rad.Mount the rad in line with the chassis centerline.Seen them mounted that way many times but none had any provision for protection.Just an idea that I feel can be made to work.Man all I can say is that I've seen hot water burns and they are DEEP.I will try most anything to prevent being burned by fire or water.Call me dumb if you wish.

[K-fab]

Why not run one of the radiators that has the oil core built in it already???

We set up the new 10 Dez with a C&R radiator and an external oil cooler that sits right along side the radiator. (left side)

Both radiators will have a screen in front of them that sits about 1/2" off, keeps out big rocks and twigs and such.

[masterfabr]

I just had a thought.A scary thing at best! But I was thinking that the ability of water to effectively spray through a screen is fairly small and screen could actually serve 2 purposes.Deflecting debris from the front and also deflecting possible coolant spray from the rear.I'm starting to think I've seen some small louvered material that may just be the ticket.I'll try to check it out tomorrow.

[K-fab]

Not a bad idea. - or thought for that matter. *

You got me thinking about crashes and radiators.

I've rolled the Dez twice in the dunes, endoed it once in the dunes, threw it away big time in the desert race and then I rolled it off the side of a mountain last summer.

If the tumble down the hill during the race - took out two 4" diam trees, rolled/flipped in the bushes, broke lots of stuff on the car including the front stub axles didn't wad the radiator
And
If the roll over the mountain side into the trees didn't poke a hole in it

I would have to believe that I'm pretty safe from getting burned. *I also wear a three layer suit, as I sure don't want to get burned. *

The side panels and the roof panel probably have a huge amount to do with protection, the visor and lower wind screen on the hood also probably do a good job of deflecting incoming rocks - they have enough pock marks on them to show they at least do something. *The space our heads take up also protects the radiator. *I doubt that much more than a 1/3 of the surface is actually in direct line of fire from the front.

It also has a very effective rock catching screen in front of it - anything over 1/4" gets filtered out and often seems to find it's way down the back of my fire suit. *

About the only way to get to my radiator would be from a direct rear hit with a stick or branch or Jousting Rod (held by a very large chicken).

I guess what I'm getting at is that if you do have your radiator mounted up high, make sure it's well protected.

The old car doesn't have any sort of cover or air flow control panel on the back side - just the fan in the middle of it. *The new car, as you can see in the pix, has a shroud over the back side that ducts to the fan. *That, along with the full body panel setup and the screen makes me pretty confident that we'll be safe from any FOD induced radiator leaks.

Just debating my point of view with ya Fabr... [smilie=blowkiss.gif]
Now if'n you go and get all ugly on me, I'll have to release that Jousting Chicken upon your car's radiator!
I keep one around all the time,
just in case....

[masterfabr]

WHat you guys are not seeing is that I'm not really concerned with a rad collision with debris as much as a failure of a seam or core or hose from unforseen corrosion or overheat overflow or????Why don't you bring that jousting chicken to LS Memorial Day weekend?

[K-fab]

The radiators in both cars are rubber mounted. *Never seen any signs of stress on the Old Dez's.

I know the frame flexes - been through four fuel tanks due to it, but the rad is isolated enough that it's never been an issue.

I did lose a hose once - it's down low and not able to spew on the passenger compartment.

[masterfabr]

THey call those jousting chickens PHEASANTS down here.But to further the jousting match can you honestly tell me that you've never heard of a rad failure of any kind and that you've never heard of anyone getting burned from it? The arguement tyhat "it's never happened to me" is not valid IMO.Hell ,I've never been hit by lightning and don't expect to either.Doesn't keep several people a year from getting zapped/killed tho does it?Call me chicken if you want.I call it preventative design.

[Rorty]

Originally Posted by K-fab\";p=\&quot

Why not run one of the radiators that has the oil core built in it already???

Or use a Laminova which doesn't have any fins or a core to get damaged. They're quite expensive, but perfect for a buggy that's subjected to flying debris and mud build up.